Report of my First True Open Carry Day (Ashburn,VA)

[alby]

Today I decided that I wanted to eat some Chipotle for lunch. Since Chipotle serves alcohol, the time had
come to go from Concealed Carry to Open Carry. As I left my truck and approached the doors, I did the
famous "Virginia Tuck". Pulling up my shirt and tucking it behind my holster so that my weapon was visible.
I walked in, ordered my food, and left. Easy as pie.

Feeling good from that lunch time event, I then decided to take the boys (10yr old & 3/yr old) out to Fuddruckers
for dinner. Since Fuddruckers also serves alcohol, it was time to Open Carry once again. Although instead of
the Virginia Tuck, I decided to tuck all of my shirt in and make sure my weapon was clearly visible. We stood in
line for about 3-4 mins until the next available cashier called us up. After placing our orders, the cashier then
says, "Law Enforcement I assume?". I said, "No". He then repeated himself, unsure why I said "No" to being
law enforcement, yet had a firearm on my hip. So once again, I told him, "No". And that was that. The cashier
seemed bewildered. I suppose its just hard to grasp anybody who isn't law enforcement having a firearm that
is clearly visible.

After dinner, the boys and I took a trip to the Dairy Queen for some Ice Cream and then to the Gas station for
some Diesel. All while still Open Carry my weapon. Nothing special during those events. Afterwards we returned
home and called it night.

[GS78]

I'm curious.... what would you have done if you were confronted by some hostile people, either anti-guns kooks or just some trouble makers? The reason I ask is that you obviously had your young sons with you . How would you have handled a confrontation with trouble makers? Don't get me wrong, I love kids, but two young boys in a situtation could and would likely be a disadvantage at best...

[alby]

I'm curious.... what would you have done if you were confronted by some hostile people, either anti-guns kooks or just some trouble makers? The reason I ask is that you obviously had your young sons with you . How would you have handled a confrontation with trouble makers? Don't get me wrong, I love kids, but two young boys in a situtation could and would likely be a disadvantage at best...

I suppose it all depends on the level of their hostilities and what was done. Working on some assumptions, lets say
some hostile anti-gun people decided to confront me in the restaurant. I would ignore these people and seeked out
management to deal with these people who are disturbing me as a patron. Hopefully getting those people kicked out of
the restaurant. Because if they refused to abide by mgmt's request, the police could be called and they would be arrested
for trespassing. After which, I would go back to minding my own business, unless mgmt then turned to me and said I was
trouble and should also leave.

I'm not sure how children would matter much in such an event.

Now if this turned into a physical assault, with or without children, I'm not sure it matters. Because you could be anywhere
with your family and be assaulted. Be it at a restaurant, an ATM, a parking lot, etc... So in a case in which I felt that I was
being physically threatened, then I would first attempt to shield my kids behind me. Put my hand on my weapon and keeping it
holstered while not saying a word and starring down the possible assailants. Should they attack, all one can do is pray that
God will guide my hand accordingly. I will say that children can be a disadvantage, but its also a real world situation that
any family member with a CHP might have to contented with. And you just aren't lucky enough to choose the venue in
which such a show down might take place.

[LFS]

The next time they ask "Law Enforcement?" you should say, "No, just law abiding."

Regarding the scenario above about being attacked with your family, you should always clearly and forcefully say something to the would be attacker. That lets them know in unambiguous terms you are serious. And it keys bystanding witnesses into the situation - otherwise they might observe that you just pulled a gun for no reason. If they hear you say "Stay back! Leave my family alone!" they'll understand that you feel threatened and that you are defending your family.

[allingeneral]

The next time they ask "Law Enforcement?" you should say, "No, just law abiding."

Regarding the scenario above about being attacked with your family, you should always clearly and forcefully say something to the would be attacker. That lets them know in unambiguous terms you are serious. And it keys bystanding witnesses into the situation - otherwise they might observe that you just pulled a gun for no reason. If they hear you say "Stay back! Leave my family alone!" they'll understand that you feel threatened and that you are defending your family.

Two excellent thoughts in my opinion.

Congrats on your first OC, alby!

[Vahunter]

The next time they ask "Law Enforcement?" you should say, "No, just law abiding."

Or "No but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express once." That's my favorite.

[Jericho01]

Chipotle for lunch,then Fuddruckers for dinner followed by Dairy Queen for dessert? I say worry about your diet and not the antis...he he he

[alby]

Chipotle for lunch,then Fuddruckers for dinner followed by Dairy Queen for dessert? I say worry about your diet and not the antis...he he he

Hahahah... Consider it a result of the wife being gone for the whole day. lol
Without her cooking, I'm chasing the junk food. lol

[Derby]

I wasnt aware you could Open Carry into a place with alcohol that is nice I suppose..

I mean worst case scenario they ask you to leave right?

Sorry to be... newbish LOL


I turn 21 in 29 days cant wait to get my CCW and go buy another gun =P

[allingeneral]

I wasnt aware you could Open Carry into a place with alcohol that is nice I suppose.

You *MUST* OC in an establishment that serves alcohol. CC is not allowed

The Code of Virginia section 18.2-308.

Personal protection; carrying concealed weapons; when lawful to carry.

J3. No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in � 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia; however, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer or any retired law-enforcement officer who meets the definition of a "qualified retired law-enforcement officer" pursuant to 18 U.S.C. � 926C and is carrying the identification required by such statute from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.

I mean worst case scenario they ask you to leave right?

Yes, they can ask you to leave, and you should immediately comply. You can provide a few words of wisdom in a brief discussion on your way out the door, but that is discussed in several other threads around here.

I turn 21 in 29 days cant wait to get my CCW and go buy another gun =P

Happy Birthday next month! You should have your CHP by mid-February if you file for it right after you turn 21.

[Derby]

OMG really I didnt think it was going to take that long ugh!!!

I figured it would take a few weeks, I cant start any process before Im 21 can I?

And thanks for all the information!!!

I knew you couldnt CCW but I didnt know you COULD OC

[allingeneral]

The county has up to 45 days to approve or deny your CHP application. You must be 21 years of age to file your request.

Paragraph D of the same Virginia Code section cited above (18.2-308) states in part:

D. Any person 21 years of age or older may apply in writing to the clerk of the circuit court of the county or city in which he resides, or if he is a member of the United States Armed Forces, the county or city in which he is domiciled, for a five-year permit to carry a concealed handgun.
[...]
The court shall issue the permit and notify the State Police of the issuance of the permit within 45 days of receipt of the completed application unless it is determined that the applicant is disqualified. Any order denying issuance of the permit shall state the basis for the denial of the permit and the applicant's right to and the requirements for perfecting an appeal of such order pursuant to subsection L. An application is deemed complete when all information required to be furnished by the applicant is delivered to and received by the clerk of court before or concomitant with the conduct of a state or national criminal history records check. If the court has not issued the permit or determined that the applicant is disqualified within 45 days of the date of receipt noted on the application, the clerk shall certify on the application that the 45-day period has expired, and send a copy of the certified application to the applicant. The certified application shall serve as a de facto permit, which shall expire 90 days after issuance, and shall be recognized as a valid concealed handgun permit when presented with a valid government-issued photo identification pursuant to subsection H, until the court issues a five-year permit or finds the applicant to be disqualified.

Read the full code here for more information: http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504 ... d+18.2-308

[Derby]

Wow thanks!! Still learning a lot, dont I have to take the CCW course first? Before asking for the CCW or?

Sorry for hi-jacking OP

[allingeneral]

Wow thanks!! Still learning a lot, dont I have to take the CCW course first? Before asking for the CCW or?

Yes, you need to complete some form of training. Read through http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504 ... d+18.2-308 paragraph G for training requirements.

Actually - it would be a good idea for you to read through that entire page in order to get an overview of the entire process, requirements and a feel for what's allowed and not allowed.

[Derby]

Thanks!!!

A lot of great people on this site!!!

[BluemontGlock]

"A lot of great people on this site!!!"- Derby

..and it only took your 38 posts to figure that out ???


Damm skippy!

[Derby]

HAHAHAHA actually I found this out after my 3rd post I just figure I would make it official and let everyone know how I feel =P


I am kinda bummed that it might take me to feb but eh whatever no worries

[alby]

Don't forget, its a (CHP) and not a (CCW).

http://www.vsp.state.va.us/Firearms_Res ... ealed.shtm


Your permit doesn't allow you to conceal carry a machete or some other type of "Weapon".
Only a Handgun.


But take note... Thanks to our wonderful citizens in Virginia with the election of
Bob McDonnell, the issue with having to OC in places that serve alcohol will likely be
abolished in the Spring. We tried back in March/April to change the law and Gov. Kaine
veto'd it. The General Assembly didn't have the votes to overturn it. This time, the tables
have turned. So if all goes well, you'll be able to Conceal Carry in places that serve alcohol,
vs. being forced to open carry in those establishments.

[alby]

Here is that law which failed..

SENATE BILL NO. 1035
Offered January 14, 2009
Prefiled January 13, 2009
A BILL to amend and reenact § 18.2-308 of the Code of Virginia, relating to concealed handguns; restaurants; penalty.

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504 ... ful+SB1035



Status:
01/13/09 Senate: Prefiled and ordered printed; offered 01/14/09 095977232
01/13/09 Senate: Referred to Committee for Courts of Justice
01/28/09 Senate: Reported from Courts of Justice with amendments (9-Y 6-N)
01/30/09 Senate: Constitutional reading dispensed (39-Y 0-N)
02/02/09 Senate: Read second time
02/02/09 Senate: Reading of amendments waived
02/02/09 Senate: Committee amendments agreed to
02/02/09 Senate: Engrossed by Senate as amended SB1035E
02/02/09 Senate: Printed as engrossed 095977232-E
02/03/09 Senate: Read third time and passed Senate (20-Y 19-N)
02/03/09 Senate: Reconsideration of passage agreed to by Senate (40-Y 0-N)
02/03/09 Senate: Passed Senate (24-Y 16-N)
02/11/09 House: Placed on Calendar
02/11/09 House: Read first time
02/11/09 House: Referred to Committee on Militia, Police and Public Safety
02/18/09 House: Assigned MPPS sub: #1
02/19/09 House: Subcommittee recommends reporting with amendment(s)
02/20/09 House: Reported from Militia, Police and Public Safety with amendment (17-Y 5-N)
02/23/09 House: Read second time
02/24/09 House: Read third time
02/24/09 House: Passed by temporarily
02/24/09 House: Committee amendment rejected
02/24/09 House: Amendments by Delegate Griffith agreed to
02/24/09 House: Pending question ordered
02/24/09 House: Engrossed by House as amended
02/24/09 House: Passed House with amendments (65-Y 32-N)
02/24/09 House: VOTE: --- PASSAGE (65-Y 32-N)
02/24/09 House: Reconsideration of House passage agreed to by House
02/24/09 House: Passed House with amendments (66-Y 33-N)
02/24/09 House: VOTE: --- PASSAGE #2 (66-Y 33-N)
02/25/09 Senate: House amendments agreed to by Senate (24-Y 14-N)
02/25/09 Senate: Reconsideration of House amendments agreed to by Senate (36-Y 1-N)
02/25/09 Senate: House amendments agreed to by Senate (22-Y 16-N)
03/04/09 Senate: Enrolled
03/04/09 Senate: Bill text as passed Senate and House (SB1035ER)
03/05/09 Senate: Signed by President
03/06/09 House: Signed by Speaker
03/30/09 Governor: Vetoed by Governor
04/07/09 Senate: Placed on Calendar
04/08/09 Senate: Motion to pass in enrolled form rejected (24-Y 16-N)
04/08/09 Senate: Senate sustained Governor's veto

[BluemontGlock]

and then we get the Cassle (Castle?) Doctrine...

that is when i will have a real BBQ...
until then,...