Got that Auto 5!!

[M1A4ME]

Well, I got that Auto 5 Wednesday night (Green Tops). Got it home, looked up the serial number on the Browning website (well, tried to anyway). It says between 1903 and 1939 guns numbered up to 229,000 were imported into the US. Then WW2 stopped production and the records were lost. Remington made Auto 5's during the war and production in Belgium (FN) began again after the war.

Mine (see that, Mine) is prewar. Serial number 197XXX.

I field stripped it last night. Interior of barrel shiny as new and just needed a few passes with brush and patches to get it clean enough for me. The forend (cracked) has a number stamped into the wood identical to the serial number on the receiver. I did not get the buttstock off (dog gone those FN/Browning screws has some thin slots - I ordered Brownell's "Auto 5" screw driver kits this morning) to see if it had a serial number somewhere.

I took some 0000 steel wool and 3n1 oil and started polishing. Man that thing cleaned up pretty. Green Tops graded is "Poor" condition. You would not believe how good it looks now. One spot of nasty pitting on the rear of the receiver but the rest of the receiver and barrel are now mostly a nice shiny blue. Not the blue of a new Browning but dog gone good for a 70+ year old gun. Even though I've ordered a synthetic stock/forend I'm going to work on the originals. Just need to strip'em and try my hand at some checkering refurbishment.

Also ordered a set of springs, friction rings, receiver and buttplate screws for it. Someone buggered up the screws some time in the past. I'll install the new ones when I completely strip it down and then try to repair the heads on the old screws if I can (spares).

I'm fighting the urge to take it down to the edge of the woods behind my house and cutting loose with 5 rounds.

[NickLikesGuns]

[M1A4ME]

Got the e-mails from Midway and Brownell's saying the stuff I ordered for the Auto 5 should be in Wednesday. No word yet from MGW about the stuff I ordered from them.

Christmas in May!! Going home for a day or two near the end of the week so I can probably force myself to wait till then to shoot it.

[Pumbaa]

I don't believe you....

Doesn't exist without PICTURES!!!

PHOTOS SON!!!! I AM SITTING HERE DYING TO SEE THIS BABY!!!

[OakRidgeStars]

Yeah, what he said ^^^

[kanata67]

Yeah, what he said ^^^

what he said he said

[M1A4ME]

Okay, okay, okay!

You bullied me into digging out the camera to take pictures (oh yeah, and I got that factory stock off last night with help from my youngest son - that darn thing acted like it was glued to the receiver).

This shotgun was graded as in poor condition by Green Tops. It ain't new but it sure looked a lot better after the 3n1 oil and 0000 steel wool scrubbing. Also got my screw driver kit from Brownell's (European made shotguns have some dog gone thin slotted screws in them) so I'll try to take it all the way apart this weekend, clean up the inside and get it back together.

It came out clean enough now I'm wondering about the wisdom of getting it parkerized. I may just leave it blued and work on the stock/for end to get them cleaned up, sharpen up the checkering and refinished and then put them back on. We'll see.

Pictures, as ordered.....

[M1A4ME]

Guess it'll take a second post, the window keeps jumping around too bad to post more links in the first post...... Oh, the wood for end and stock are original and have the receiver serial number stamped into the wood inside.



[URL=http://s307.photobucket.com/albums/nn29 ... CN0207.jpg][/URL

Not too bad for a 70+ year old shotgun someone obviously used over the years.

Oh yeah, the cat...when the guns come out the cats congregate around them. I'm not sure whether its the Hoppe's #9 or the 3n1 oil but they will rub on the guns, lay on the gun cases, and even fight over them if one gets too close to a gun the other one has staked a claim on. When that first picture was taken the yellow and white cat was lying between it and the stairs to make sure the black cat didn't sneak down the stairs and get close to the shotgun. When the black cat did come downstairs they got into a running/squalling/spittng fight across the floor and into the net room.

[gunderwood]

Congrats. That should be fun.

[Jakeiscrazy]

Oh yeah, the cat...when the guns come out the cats congregate around them. I'm not sure whether its the Hoppe's #9 or the 3n1 oil but they will rub on the guns, lay on the gun cases, and even fight over them if one gets too close to a gun the other one has staked a claim on. When that first picture was taken the yellow and white cat was lying between it and the stairs to make sure the black cat didn't sneak down the stairs and get close to the shotgun. When the black cat did come downstairs they got into a running/squalling/spittng fight across the floor and into the net room.

That's funny, my dog is anti gun. She doesn't even like the sound of the action. She leaves the room when they come out.

[M1A4ME]

I used my new "auto 5 screwdriver kit" to take the buttstock off and pull the trigger housing out of the receiver to start the internal cleanup (really nasty/dirty inside).

I could not get one lock screw out of the receiver so I didn't get the bolt/action spring, etc. out of it yet. Just carb. spraye dit out as good as possible with two cans, let it dry and rem-oiled it.

I disassembled the trigger group and I'm beginning to see why the action on the auto 5 is so smooth compared to modern designs. Leaf springs instead of coil springs sliding up and down guides, rollers where the leaf spring fits against the hammer rather that metal sliding against metal, etc., etc.

I'd already noticed the two action screws had numbers stamped on each side of the slots and when I removed the longer screws (stock screw and the two that hold the trigger housing in) they also had the same four numbers stamped in the smooth parts of the shaft between the head and the threads. Imagine a day when they took the time to stamp the last four numbers of the gun's serial number in the screws they put the gun together with.

Those days are gone, as are the people who designed and built those guns. But the guns are still out there and I'm going to take good care of this one.

[M1A4ME]

Well, the old gun works just fine. Took it to Black Creek yesterday morning.

25 rounds through it with no issues at all (other than the barrel getting a little warm).

That thing has a weird feeling recoil to it. The way the recoil spring throughs the barrel forward makes it jump "the wrong way". I'm used to getting kicked but not used to one trying to jump off my shoulder.

I got it home and started cleaning it. I got out my new recoil spring and friction rings to compare them to the old ones. The new spring from Brownells looked huge (both longer and larger coils) and I figured the length difference was due to the gun's age. I put the new spring on (old friction rings) and noticed the handguard/for arm was rubbing going on (not a good sign). I took it down behind the shed on the back lot and it would not function. Didn't even try. The new spring is not the right size. It might work with the wood for arm but I didn't try it. It won't work with the synthetic for arm so I put the old recoil spring back on it after wiping everything down.

I shot my nephew's Glock in .357 Sig and I finally found a Glock accurate enough to be worth owning. Now I've gotta figure out how to talk him out of it..... Three bullets tore one hole and two others were slightly out of the hole (one was my fault, I new it when the trigger broke, at a range of about 12 or 13 yards. Not very far, I know, but I'll bet with more practice getting used to that trigger I could get better.

Too bad .357 sig is not so easy to find on the shelves and more costly than .40 S&W. Has anyone necked down .40 S&W to make .357 Sig? I make 30.06 brass out of .270, 7mm Express, and 25.06 and I make .308 out of .243 and 7mm-08 but I haven't tried anything similar with pistol brass.

[Jakeiscrazy]

Well, the old gun works just fine. Took it to Black Creek yesterday morning.

25 rounds through it with no issues at all (other than the barrel getting a little warm).

That thing has a weird feeling recoil to it. The way the recoil spring throughs the barrel forward makes it jump "the wrong way". I'm used to getting kicked but not used to one trying to jump off my shoulder.

I got it home and started cleaning it. I got out my new recoil spring and friction rings to compare them to the old ones. The new spring from Brownells looked huge (both longer and larger coils) and I figured the length difference was due to the gun's age. I put the new spring on (old friction rings) and noticed the handguard/for arm was rubbing going on (not a good sign). I took it down behind the shed on the back lot and it would not function. Didn't even try. The new spring is not the right size. It might work with the wood for arm but I didn't try it. It won't work with the synthetic for arm so I put the old recoil spring back on it after wiping everything down.

Maybe you can do a little fitting of the forearm to get it to work.

I shot my nephew's Glock in .357 Sig and I finally found a Glock accurate enough to be worth owning. Now I've gotta figure out how to talk him out of it..... Three bullets tore one hole and two others were slightly out of the hole (one was my fault, I new it when the trigger broke, at a range of about 12 or 13 yards. Not very far, I know, but I'll bet with more practice getting used to that trigger I could get better.

Too bad .357 sig is not so easy to find on the shelves and more costly than .40 S&W. Has anyone necked down .40 S&W to make .357 Sig? I make 30.06 brass out of .270, 7mm Express, and 25.06 and I make .308 out of .243 and 7mm-08 but I haven't tried anything similar with pistol brass.

I think you mean "I found a Glock I can shoot accurately." They are certainly more accurate that the shooter.

Necking down .40 looks like a no go. http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/inde ... 03629.html

[M1A4ME]

Nope. The first and only Glock I'd shot up till Saturday turned me against them for many years. We had two 9mm pistols at the range that day. The cheap Taurus copy of the Beretta M92 shot rings around the Glock and my Colt Combat Commander made both of them look bad.

The Glock I shot Saturday shot very nice groups. I'm not recoil shy, I actually think my 2&3/4" Ruger speed six is fun to shoot .357 magnum ammo in. That sofball sized fireball (even in broad daylight) is really something. But what beats that is the S&W M29 with 240 grain slugs. It throws a basketball sized fireball at the muzzle in daylight.

Having only shot 1911's up to that time I shot that first Glock I was really disappointed in the groups. Whether is was the ammo or the pistol wasn't important to me at the time as it wasn't mine to try to "fix".

Yeah, I may try to sand out the inside of that synthetic fore arm for the Auto 5 to see if I can make it work. For now I've just put the original spring back in it as if it gets shot it will be with the Federal or Remington "dove" loads in the 100 round boxes from WalMart.

[gunderwood]

Has anyone necked down .40 S&W to make .357 Sig?

That's basically what .357SIG is, but it won't work. The .40 brass is too short to properly neck down.

On the plus side, the necked cartridge in theory makes it even more reliable and Glock was able to provide a fully supported chamber because of it. I really like mine.

[M1A4ME]

[quote="gunderwoodOn the plus side, the necked cartridge in theory makes it even more reliable and Glock was able to provide a fully supported chamber because of it. I really like mine.[/quote]

That's good to hear. I'm a reloader and I was nervous about the Glocks after reading all stories about the issues wit the .40 cal. guns. I had been planning to look for a Ruger 1911 at the gunshows. N ow it may be Glock. I may look at the SA XD's, too.

[M1A4ME]

Tried to get that right side action screw lock screw out again today after letting it soak with some penetrating oil. Still no success getting that darn screw out. Just chewing up the screw and twisting screw driver blades.

Did take the action spring/guide out and clean up the shaft and installed the new action spring. That action spring guide made of wood!! Wood!! The old spring was a little hard to get off the guide due to the way the last coil was compressed/crimped into the wood. The new spring was about 1/2" longer than the old spring.

I'll keep working on that one lock screw (or take it to a gunsmity to get it drilled out). I might try a little heat to see if that will loosen it up. No clue why that one screw is so darn tight compared to the rest of them. That thing would make a good grouse gun if I still lived in the mountains and still hunted.

[Jakeiscrazy]

Tried to get that right side action screw lock screw out again today after letting it soak with some penetrating oil. Still no success getting that darn screw out. Just chewing up the screw and twisting screw driver blades.

Did take the action spring/guide out and clean up the shaft and installed the new action spring. That action spring guide made of wood!! Wood!! The old spring was a little hard to get off the guide due to the way the last coil was compressed/crimped into the wood. The new spring was about 1/2" longer than the old spring.

I'll keep working on that one lock screw (or take it to a gunsmity to get it drilled out). I might try a little heat to see if that will loosen it up. No clue why that one screw is so darn tight compared to the rest of them. That thing would make a good grouse gun if I still lived in the mountains and still hunted.

I bet it's some red loctite or something. Defenitly try heat.

PS: Someone from THR said:

Also, I highly recommend purchasing a set of Grace screwdrivers for your A5. The screw slots are not a standard size and Grace makes a set of screwdrivers that will fit properly. You can buy a set from Brownells.
If you use regular screwdrivers, you can and WILL bugger up the screws!!!11

Followed up by another member saying:

I really can't recommend anyone but a gunsmith who knows what he is doing tearing an A-5 down completely.

Just take off the wood and go after it with Brake Cleaner and small brushes.

There is stuff in there you don't even want to mess with!

And the tip about using the correct screw-drivers is also very true.

Browning used to use extra-thin slots & hardened screwdrivers made by elves in the Black Forest!
The fairy-dust heat treating was all that kept them from breaking and scratching the receivers.

[M1A4ME]

I've got the (incredibly) thin bladed screwdriver set from Brownell's. All I can say is WOW! Had I not bought it and brought it home I'd neveer believed there were screws with such thing slots.

As for not taking it apart? Well, I take everything apart (except 700R4 automatci transmissions ). If I can't get it back together it'll be the first one I failed on. I bought a set of screws from Missouri Gun Works (I think that's the name of the place) as they have all kinds of Browning gun parts (that's where I got my firing pin for the BDM after the gunsmith who works for Bob's Sporting Goods on Rt. 360 said there was no way to get that part anymore. If anyone needs Browning parts that's a good place to look. Not cheap but they are real Browning parts and in some cases there is no other source for them.

The FAL I took apart to the last pin/screw so I could strip the cheap paint off it, prep it, spray it with ceramic paint, bake it in the over (really need to that when the wife is gone shopping for the day with her mom or sister ) and then put it back together.

The Win. M97 is the worst one I ever took apart. I didn't know a gun could have so many small parts.

I've already had the trigger housing apart.

You know, the Auto 5 (so far) is remarkably close to the Ithaca M37 pump shotgun (another John Browning design by the way). Same type of small locking screws on the bigger screws. same type of action screws that go in each side of the receiver to hold the internal bolt/feeding mechanism in place and let it work. The Auto 5 design is older by a few years.

[M1A4ME]

Well, a little heat from the old propane torch (enough to dry the oil off the surface and make it too not to hold onto) two more broken screw driver tips (cheap ones from a Brownell's gunsmith kit) and one slightly twisted screwdriver bit (the special Browning Auto 5 screw driver set from Brownells) and that right side action screw/locking screw popped loose.

Got it all apart (had to heat up the screw holding the magazine tube disconnect lever on, too). Cleaned up/cleaned out, lubed up (some rem-oil, some mobil 1), wiped down and put it all back together. Functions fine and its cleaner than its been in, oh, 40 or 50 years most likely.

While I had the bolt out I noticed that Mr. Browning also designed a firing pin block into the bolt so that the firing pin cannot move forward to strike the primer until the bolt is in position and locked up in the barrel. Sorry to keep pointing out the neat features on this gun but please remember, the design dates back to 1903. When you start looking at the internal parts it amazing how thin/small some of them are and the intricate bends/contours in them so that them fit and work together - and they don't break. Steel. Forged and machined steel. Lasts a long time compared to aluminum and plastic.