Open Carry vs. Concealed Carry in ABC Establishments

[Derby]

Question if I may what is so wrong with CCW in a place that serves alcohol I can understand like a bar type deal that has a bunch of crazy kids drinking and trying to fight people....

But a restaurant with beer? I dont understand what the big deal is.

Also why would they rather you OC then CCW, just to make people feel aware? Possibly uneasy and complain vs them not knowing you have it?

Like college I think if you have a CHP you should be aloud to carry.... Period

Because look at all the college shootings, they could have been stopped a lot sooner and saved quite a few people if some students were carrying.

Saved a lot of lives they could. (yoda)

[ProShooter]

The law is the law, until it ain't the law no mo!

[Derby]

Is there like any reasoning to it or we say it goes!

[allingeneral]

This was question number 1 on the VCDL candidate survey in 2003.

Current Virginia law includes penalties for anyone carrying a gun while under the influence of alcohol or illegal drugs. However, since 1995, Virginia's concealed carry law has prohibited lawful concealed carry by permit holders (even if they aren't drinking) in ABC licensed restaurants and clubs. For nearly 100 years prior to 1995, permit holders faced no such restriction and there were no problems. Because of this recent (1995) change in Virginia’s concealed weapons law, 1) restaurants have become safety zones for violent criminals, 2) law-abiding citizens may be at risk not only at dinner, but when walking to and from their car in a dark, secluded parking lot, and 3) law-abiding citizens may be forced to unsafely store their loaded firearm in an unattended vehicle while in a restaurant.

Will you vote FOR legislation to completely repeal this "restaurant ban" on carrying of concealed handguns by permit holders?

The entire survey and the responses can be found here: http://www.vcdl.org/surveys/survey2003.htm

[alby]

Question if I may what is so wrong with CCW in a place that serves alcohol I can understand like a bar type deal that has a bunch of crazy kids drinking and trying to fight people....

But a restaurant with beer? I dont understand what the big deal is.

Also why would they rather you OC then CCW, just to make people feel aware? Possibly uneasy and complain vs them not knowing you have it?

Like college I think if you have a CHP you should be aloud to carry.... Period

Because look at all the college shootings, they could have been stopped a lot sooner and saved quite a few people if some students were carrying.

Saved a lot of lives they could. (yoda)

Only a Politician can make sense of the laws they draft. lol

I know, its crazy. You can carry concealed outside a restaurant, but once inside, you must
open carry. Lets hope the General Assembly fixes this issue once and for all in Spring 2010.


.
.18.2-308 - http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504 ... d+18.2-308
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J3. No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia;
.
.
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Although if you do such, I'm not sure what the penalty is for the crime.

[LFS]

Well, I don't know what kinda bars you are going to... but if you go to a bar where you have an expectation that a fight may occur, you probably shouldn't carry at all -- OC or otherwise. Should something happen and you are involved and you survive, you'll have a legal hill to climb.

[NewColonial]

I would take LFS's reply one step further. If you have an expectation of a fight, anywhere, don't go. Period.

[Derby]

I wasnt referring to that I meant I understood why you cant carry into a bar/club.

I meant I dont understand why you cant carry into a restaurant CCW, but OC lol just odd

[alby]

I would take LFS's reply one step further. If you have an expectation of a fight, anywhere, don't go. Period.

True.. Stay away from BAR ONLY places. Stick to family style restaurants that have a bar off to the side.
Not the local biker bar with a bunch our hard drinking people. lol A shoot out in such a place wouldn't look
for anybody, no matter how legal you are trying to be.

Least we forget, in court, you are judged by a jury. And no telling if some of those members are anti-gun folks.

[Derby]

Ok sorry guys you have misunderstood....

I didnt say anything about going to a Bar only...

I said I UNDERSTAND WHY YOU CANNOT go to a bar while carrying a weapon (because of possible stupid people drinking and fighting)


What I WAS saying was, I dont understand why you cant go to a restaurant while carrying concealed... but you can carry OC it just doesnt make sense....

[gfost1]

Howdy, Derby,

I think the main problem is that Virginia does not distinguish between bars and restaurants that serve alcohol. Thus, while the VCDL and others fight to repeal the "Restaurant Ban", the antis accuse them of advocating "Guns in Bars". As far as making sense, it's politics. Sensible politics is an oxymoron.

Regards,

George

[Derby]

^ Gotcha now I understand thanks!

[LFS]

Well, I understand your frustration. The law should make sense, but it doesn't. Hey, at least we don't live in Maryland. And thank the heavens we don't live in New Jersey:

http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/2009/12 ... xemptions/

[alby]

Well, I understand your frustration. The law should make sense, but it doesn't. Hey, at least we don't live in Maryland. And thank the heavens we don't live in New Jersey:

http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/2009/12 ... xemptions/

Praise The Lord...

[zephyp]

I would take LFS's reply one step further. If you have an expectation of a fight, anywhere, don't go. Period.

[halljt3]

Imo it's ridiculously to be able to oc and not cc in a place that serves alcohol. Lets say you go to the bathroom, your at the urinal doing your businesses when in comes a drunk dude prob. taking his tenth piss of the night... he sees your gun (keep in mind your looking at the wall in front of you) and says to himself "cool a gun", and proceeds to grab it and accidentally shoots himself or you...

Now if this stupid law was not in place then the drunk guy would have never seen the gun in the first place (due to it being concealed). Just a thought...

[NewColonial]

Lets say you go to the bathroom, your at the urinal doing your businesses when in comes a drunk dude ...

Off topic, but, I never use a urinal, period. Doesn't matter if I'm armed or not. Why place yourself in a vulnerable position, with your back to everyone. Having your head smashed against the wall can't feel good.

[wally626]

It looks the restaurant ban has a good chance of being at least partially eliminated this year. CCW permitted but no drinking. Does this mean you can still drink if open carrying? Say you go in and there is a really good wine on sale, can you take the coat off or do the VA tuck and get a drink?

[zephyp]

Imo it's ridiculously to be able to oc and not cc in a place that serves alcohol. Lets say you go to the bathroom, your at the urinal doing your businesses when in comes a drunk dude prob. taking his tenth piss of the night... he sees your gun (keep in mind your looking at the wall in front of you) and says to himself "cool a gun", and proceeds to grab it and accidentally shoots himself or you...

Now if this stupid law was not in place then the drunk guy would have never seen the gun in the first place (due to it being concealed). Just a thought...

I make myself aware of my surroundings and practice SA even if I'm carrying concealed. You never know what might happen behind you...or if the guy 2 spaces behind you in the supermarket line might pull a gun and just start shooting...now days you never know....

[Reverenddel]

As I enjoy the Garden State, and realize they have a sense of humor, I think the joke, "What's the difference between Hell, and New Jersey? Answer: The Smell, and Hell complains about that."