personal property tax

[EchoMirage]

after moving here last year, i was astonished when i received a bill for the personal property tax. i never heard of it until then. i know what it is....theyre essentially taxing you on the cars/equipment that you already own. my question is this: for all the freedom loving, gun carrying patriots i see on forums and real life, how are people not standing on the steps of the capital, demanding this tax gets repealed?

this is an honest question. is it because its a fairly small tax? do people say it makes up for the lower property taxes? do they think its justified, ie: fixing roads, schools, etc? has it been in place for so long, people are just used to it? i really find it astonishing that people would allow the state to tax them on things they already own...already paid sales tax for, insurance, registration, inspections, etc, etc.

[trailrunner]

It used to be worse but when Gilmore was the governor (late 90s?), he wound up rolling back a lot of the personal property tax. It was set to phase out shortly after he left office, but then the fiscal crisis hit around 2000, and they decided to keep some of the tax in place.

In addition to the tax, what annoyed me was paying $25 each for the stupid sticker that I had to put on the windshield. At the time, I had five cars for my family of four drivers, which meant that I had to pay a total of $125 just for the stupid stickers.

But when I moved to VA inn 1991, the thing that annoyed me the most about owning a car here was the annual safety inspection. CA did not have this, and a lot of states do not. The VA inspection does very little to improve safety. The great majority of accidents nowadays are caused by inattentive, impaired, or reckless driving, not by a mechanical problem. States with safety inspections do not have a lower accident rate than states that do not have them. The inspection is just a way to force you to get your car in to a service station and pay for questionable repairs.

[ShotgunBlast]

Totally agree. I personally would prefer the Fair Tax (sales tax with a monthly prebate on taxable purchases up to the poverty level) and get rid of income/corporate taxes and property taxes.

In the end, I guess Virginians overall prefer this mix of low sales tax, low income tax, and low property tax to pay the bills.

[EchoMirage]

But when I moved to VA inn 1991, the thing that annoyed me the most about owning a car here was the annual safety inspection. CA did not have this, and a lot of states do not. The VA inspection does very little to improve safety. The great majority of accidents nowadays are caused by inattentive, impaired, or reckless driving, not by a mechanical problem. States with safety inspections do not have a lower accident rate than states that do not have them. The inspection is just a way to force you to get your car in to a service station and pay for questionable repairs.

this was the first shock i had when moving here. back in the police state of NJ -of all places- inspection is now every 2 years, up to 4+ yrs for a new car, and is nothing more then emissions. nothing else. they hook up to your OBDII, read the emission values, and youre off. 5 minutes. and its state run, and FREE when going to a state facility. i was flabbergasted when i learned you can actually fail inspection in VA for wiper blades.....i mean really. i left a police sektor to come to a state that i thought had more personal freedom; and now i get taxed on the things i have already owned for over 10yrs, and i need some grease monkey telling me my vehicle failed for a wiper blade??

the only advantage i see to such a stringent inspection is when buying a used car. if it has a recent valid inspection, then you have reasonable assurance the car is relatively safe and solid.

has there been any push to repeal the personal prop tax or loosen the inspection requirements?

[trailrunner]

this was the first shock i had when moving here. back in the police state of NJ -of all places- inspection is now every 2 years, up to 4+ yrs for a new car, and is nothing more then emissions. nothing else. they hook up to your OBDII, read the emission values, and youre off. 5 minutes. and its state run, and FREE when going to a state facility. i was flabbergasted when i learned you can actually fail inspection in VA for wiper blades.....i mean really. i left a police sektor to come to a state that i thought had more personal freedom; and now i get taxed on the things i have already owned for over 10yrs, and i need some grease monkey telling me my vehicle failed for a wiper blade??

The emissions inspection is federally mandated and is not the same as the state safety inspection. When George Allen was governor, (mid 90s), he filed a lawsuit on behalf of VA against the feds trying to get the state out of the emissions test. The state lost, but at least he was trying. For me, that was no big deal because CA started the whole emissions testing thing, so I had been living with that for a while. CA is terrible terrible terrible when it comes to emissions, with strong restrictions on who can do the work and what parts you can and can't use.

If you read the law, they can fail you on safety for just about any trivial thing. The garage I go to is pretty fair when it comes to safety inspections, but sometimes (probably when business is slow) he gets me for windshield wipers.

the only advantage i see to such a stringent inspection is when buying a used car. if it has a recent valid inspection, then you have reasonable assurance the car is relatively safe and solid.

In a free market, the buyer can get an inspection before he buys a car, but that doesn't mean that it should be forced on everyone every year. Really, it's just a make-work bill for the auto repair shops.

has there been any push to repeal the personal prop tax or loosen the inspection requirements?

When I first moved here, I contacted my delegate to the assembly about repealing the inspection law. He was polite, but I'm sure he was laughing inside at me - this outsider to good 'ol Virginny with my left-coast ideas. My state senator (Dick Saslaw) at the time owned a very successful gas station in Fairfax County, so there was no way in hell that he was going to help me. Since then, gun rights have become more important to me, so I same my ammo for that fight. Most Virginians I've talked to don't have any problem with the safety inspections and I always feel like they think I'm from outer space when I bring up the issue. Repealing the car tax was a big deal in the late 90s, but since then it's pretty much fizzled, and neither party seems to be interested in picking up the issue. Really, they'd have to make up the revenue some other way, so to some degree it's a zero sum game.

[FiremanBob]

The purpose of the annual inspection requirement is to increase the income of auto repair shops in the state. But if you try to protest against the lobby, you will be branded "anti-safety".

[trailrunner]

Totally agree. I personally would prefer the Fair Tax (sales tax with a monthly prebate on taxable purchases up to the poverty level) and get rid of income/corporate taxes and property taxes.

In the end, I guess Virginians overall prefer this mix of low sales tax, low income tax, and low property tax to pay the bills.

I agree fully that a flat sales tax is the way to go. I think (could be wrong) that when they lowered the car tax in the late 90s, that was offset that by raising the sales tax. Too bad they didn't go all the way and eliminate the car tax completely.

While we're on the subject, what I would like is that at every gas pump, there is a separate total for how much you paid for the fuel, and how much you paid in tax. People would be surprised to see how much in fuel taxes they pay. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but let's add a little clarity.

[trailrunner]

The purpose of the annual inspection requirement is to increase the income of auto repair shops in the state. But if you try to protest against the lobby, you will be branded "anti-safety".

Exactly.

[trailrunner]

this was the first shock i had when moving here. back in the police state of NJ -of all places- inspection is now every 2 years, up to 4+ yrs for a new car, and is nothing more then emissions. nothing else. they hook up to your OBDII, read the emission values, and youre off. 5 minutes. and its state run, and FREE when going to a state facility.

BTW, NJ is sort of a weird state when it comes to gas stations. The gas prices are lower than they are here, yet all stations have to be FULL service? The first time I bought gas in NJ, I got out of my car and started operating the pump. The guy at the station wasn't happy with me, but I didn't know better.

[EchoMirage]

BTW, NJ is sort of a weird state when it comes to gas stations. The gas prices are lower than they are here, yet all stations have to be FULL service? The first time I bought gas in NJ, I got out of my car and started operating the pump. The guy at the station wasn't happy with me, but I didn't know better.

yep. people dont believe me when i say nj was full service, and STILL cheaper then here. right now, in edison nj, gas is 1.69. i havent seen that since the 90s. best ive heard of in va is 1.89, here in smithfield.

i also dont get when people beat their chests about 'not being allowed to pump their own gas'......out of all the things you can be up in arms for, its pumping gas?? if ANYTHING, it creates a job that anyone can do. not so much nowadays, but 15+ years ago, any highschool kid could get a job pumping gas. now, its all older, probably-illegal immigrants pumping gas, but thats besides the point.

let them earn their money, and ill stay warm and dry inside the car.

[jdonovan]

how are people not standing on the steps of the capital, demanding this tax gets repealed?

this is an honest question. is it because its a fairly small tax? do people say it makes up for the lower property taxes?

So the state/county/town has to extract money so it can run the gov't. Honestly I'd like a bunch less gov't but thats a different angle.

so the question really comes down to how you prefer to be robbed. At the register, on pay day, twice a year via your mortgage company, etc...

The gov't is still going to get its share, which vein do you want tapped?

[HighExpert]

I am amazed we have not heard from the tree huggers about this personal property tax. It is regressive in that the older, read less efficient and dirtier, cars pay less tax. This is why we have junk on the road in VA. Inspection, B.S.. Anyone who is here awhile learns which shop to go to that collect your $16 and put your sticker on. There are lots of them.

[SHMIV]

Those new cars are highly priced garbage. Give me an older car with a V8 and a carburetor.

Especially 60's era Cadillacs. No airbags, foot room, trunk space.

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[Swampman]

Mandating a small inspection fee was the way they sold the sheeple on this intrusion. You guys down in the more populated localities will find more stations that manufacture problems to make up for the $16 fee. Up here, and probably down in the southwestern part of the state, it's pretty easy to find a guy who will spend 15 minutes on the lights-horn-wipers inspection, slap on a sticker and send you on your way. Those of us in the western parts of the state also don't have the emissions crap to worry about, but I'm sure that's coming.

It has been said, and it is true, they'll get ya someway, somehow. Just depends on which vein you want tapped.

Oh, and the state run emissions inspections in the Peoples Republic of Maryland isn't "free." Taxes, taxes, taxes.

[scott9050]

I paid $1200 in car taxes this past year. The fact that they value my cars higher than full blown retail is ridiculous. I was charged a valuation on my Mustang a full $2000 higher than I paid for it OTD in 2013 and a full $6000 higher than current NADA valuation.

[dorminWS]

I paid $1200 in car taxes this past year. The fact that they value my cars higher than full blown retail is ridiculous. I was charged a valuation on my Mustang a full $2000 higher than I paid for it OTD in 2013 and a full $6000 higher than current NADA valuation.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

It's supposed to be based upon fair market value. I wonder what your Commissioner of Revenue is hanging his hat on to value cars if not the NADA blue book? But I've been taxed for much more than I'd just paid for a new care, too. The answer I got was that just because you got a racehorse deal when you bought it doesn't mean you do what you get taxed on it.