New Range planning in the NOVA area

[MarcSpaz]

1. We are planning on a 50, 100, and 200 yard rifle range. Would this suit your needs?

Do you have the acreage for a 300 yard shoot point or more? I have been looking for something long enough that windage and elevation start to matter. Right now it's a weekend trip or an 18-20 day of driving and shooting to get 300-1000 yards. A near zero at 100 and targeting an object 300 yards out would really spice things up for folks who have 600 to 1000 yard long guns who want a bit more of a challenge.

2. We are also planning a Pistol range up to 25 yards. Would this suit your needs?

Sounds good. Most pistol engagements are 7 to 10 yards. 25 yards is perfect for refining control methods.

3. Should this range be available to the public for an hourly fee, or would you pay for a yearly membership to keep it members only and keep out the riff raff?

I think hourly brings crowds and annual members get frustrated if there is a wait to shoot because someone who is not loyal is burning range time. However, making the membership affordable for the middle class and requiring a background check or current/valid CHP to join should do the trick.

I currently belong to Blue Ridge. PITA all the time due to non-members and amateurs burning lane time and shooting the ceiling and walls, but its better than not shooting when its 20 degrees outside.

I also currently belong to a 100 yard outdoor range that is members only and it is fantastic. No wait. I know most of the other shooters. Lots of respect for each other (staff and shooters alike).

4. We plan on having a Gun shop/FFL. What do you want from your FFL that you're not currently getting?

Nothing special that I can think of. I work on my own stuff, so I am not sure what non-techs really need.

[CivilEngineer]

I work for Fairfax, message me if you need help. I'm a civil engineer, there are extensive zoning criteria you must meet for a range.

[RWBlue01]

To be honest, for a minimum, 25 yards and 100 yards is a good start. Anything more than that is just a bonus. I would love a range that goes all the way to 1000 yards, but then again, I am not sure how often it would get used.

You will need to open up the range to the public. This brings in new blood. But I would restrict them to times when business is slow, non-moving target, have them watch a safety video… This will move people from non-member to member if they will use the facility often.

Transfers for $25. This is reasonable for the time and effort involved. These need to be able to come from non-FFLs.

Free Wifi would be nice, but most of us can do that with out phones now.

Clean restrooms are a must.

Let’s limit the stupid rules.
No rapid fire\No holsters, set up the range to range to allow all holsters. If the range is setup correctly, things like shoulder holsters can be used safely\No reloaded ammo.\Only shoot ammo bought at our location\Enforcement of unwritten rules (write all the rules down and enforce them for everyone).

I like the idea of a shooting gallery. Maybe one in 22LR then go bigger. If you are going to do this, you may want to have a way for someone to score themselves or film it.

NRA members get a discount.

[lizjimbo]

If you have not yet a land surveyor or civil engineer to prepare the site plan shoot me a pm or ask for my email. We can work out a fair deal!

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[lizjimbo]

One other option for the rifle range I would like to see is a stand and shoot option not just bench rest.

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[jrswanson1]

Your planned range sounds great. I'd definitely join up if it was members only.

[MarcSpaz]

One other option for the rifle range I would like to see is a stand and shoot option not just bench rest.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

I agree. Bench shooting is nice if I need to use a bench vise to zero my weapon, but shooting standing, kneeling, sitting and prone are real-world positions. I never heard of guys carrying tables into battle or hunting so they can get a stable shot off. LOL

If I were range owner for a day and designing my own rifle range...

Standing/kneeling/sitting/prone at 100-200
Kneeling/sitting/prone at 300
prone at 400-1000
Movable benches at all points for those who wish to use them.

Your planned range sounds great. I'd definitely join up if it was members only.

That would make a big impact on my choice. Right now I am looking at 340 and peacemaker. Peacemaker is a 100 mile drive for me, but they have a members only section including a 1000 yard shoot point.

[gunderwood]

Bench shooting is nice if I need to use a bench vise to zero my weapon, but shooting standing, kneeling, sitting and prone are real-world positions. I never heard of guys carrying tables into battle or hunting so they can get a stable shot off. LOL

+1

[GeneFrenkle]

In the olden days with the nifty big hats, those were used to prop up the rifles when the infantryman was prone so steady the shot.

[MarcSpaz]

Nice! I'll take my folding, telescoping bi-pod over a hat or a table any day. But in a jam, we can make anything work. LOL

[already]

Yes yes yes, please open an outdoor range in Fairfax!

[TBob]

1. We are planning on a 50, 100, and 200 yard rifle range. Would this suit your needs?

That's a good minimum. I'd like to see 300 yards with longer if possible, but understand that land is at a premium here. Would definitely like to be able to use bump-fire stocks and select fire at least at 50 yards.

2. We are also planning a Pistol range up to 25 yards. Would this suit your needs?

Sorta. There are a number of good indoor 25 yard ranges, and NRA is great a 50. Action shooting, drawing from strong-side holsters, rapid fire, rapid reload would be greatly appreciated. Target stands that could be set up at any distance on the range would be nice, with the cardboard backing available. Resetable metal plates with a rope pull to reset are my favorites for draw-and-shoot practice. I recommend in general that you offer things that you cannot get at the local indoor ranges.[/quote]

3. Should this range be available to the public for an hourly fee, or would you pay for a yearly membership to keep it members only and keep out the riff raff?

Yearly membership only. I belonged to a club in FL that was members only for a very reasonable annual fee. Prospective members were recommended by at least two existing members, except for active or retired military. Every paying member received a key to the gate lock and could shoot any time on any range during the allowed hours (basically daylight). All members had passes for their dashboard that changed every year (as did the gate key), so all could readily spot interlopers. The action shooting range had additional rules and its own gate, but all those checked out on its operation had the combo to that lock. We self-policed for safety and behavior. We had voluntary member work days to help with the upkeep a few times a year. It was the next best thing to heaven. No riff raff and the facilities lasted longer with responsible use. That scheme would be less expensive to operate because you wouldn't need dedicated range officers to watch over the hourly users, or to clean up the damage after them.

4. We plan on having a Gun shop/FFL. What do you want from your FFL that you're not currently getting?

Bulk plinking ammo for relatively cheap - like Partisan, Armscor USA, S&B, etc. Targets and backing. Available supplies should generally support the needs for range use.

Last thought: I recommend minimizing the matches. As others have said, they take on a life of their own and shut out members during peak shooting times (weekends especially). Discouraged member simply move on. We only ran 3-gun and cowboy action shooting matches on a rotating basis on Sunday mornings in FL, each once/month at most. Otherwise, all the ranges were available at all times for members to use. That's for what the bulk of the membership would be paying.

[ThinLine]

I would happily shell out $$$ for a pistol range with reactive steel targets.

A walk through course, where the shooter needs to decide which threats to address first, would be a big success.

[CSHawkeye]

You taking on any members. I am defiantly game for outdoor shooting. Took my new Remington .308 out and loved it this past weekend.

[GeneralG]

I think regardless of what your final out come is the more ranges the better. The more opportunities we provide to others to become gun enthusiasts the stronger we are. Just have to find the right people

[wolfhfac]

I just visited Peacemaker out in West Virginia and I'd say if you are going to plan for a new outdoor range, copy the Peacemaker range (obviously a scaled down version since you don't have 2300 acres to build a range on).

If you are going to be a FFL as well, make the transfer rates reasonable. Don't be like some of the other knuckleheads and charge $50 to $100 for a single firearm transfer.

Get into the bulk ammo business. Shotgun, pistol, rifle. Hook yourself up with a distributor and give bulk discount. I shoot a lot of shotgun sports and buy my shells in bulk (20 cases at a time). Some other shooters I know buy a whole pallet (around 96 cases) and split it amongst themselves. I see some ranges try to sell the cheaper Wally World shotgun target shells as much as what I would pay for the premium target shells.

I assume you will build a range just for the rifle/handgun shooters or tactical shotgunners. I wouldn't waste time trying to install a trap field. Bull Run or PG County Trap and Skeet pretty much has this locked down. And there are the Isaac Walton Leagues as well. But offer these shooters the opportunity to buy shotgun target shells in bulk at better prices than the local Dicks Sporting Goods.

Yearly membership would be good but not like something stupid like some of these private clubs where the initial fee is anywhere from several hundred to a couple thousand. There is one place out in West Virginia, just outside of Charles Town, that charges something like $6000 for initial and a yearly $3000 fee.

[optiksguy]

Hate to be the Debbie Downer here, but as much as I would love love love an outdoor range in NOVA I don't see it happening. Overcoming the likely opposition of the Supervisors and NIMBYs will be a major hurdle. I would love to be proven wrong though. Can you reveal the general location of the land you already have?

[2k05gt]

1. We are planning on a 50, 100, and 200 yard rifle range. Would this suit your needs?
Perfect, Yes Also maybe a shotgun range like for Skeet.....

2. We are also planning a Pistol range up to 25 yards. Would this suit your needs?
Yes.....

3. Should this range be available to the public for an hourly fee, or would you pay for a yearly membership to keep it members only and keep out the riff raff?
I like the Members only idea but maybe offer special days where it's open to the public.....I really hate reoccurring fees like the Blue one (I refuse to go there) Annual fees and maybe members also need to volunteer a day or two a year for ground works, fix roofs, plant trees what ever, have some stake in the ranges success and to keep the membership cost affordable.

4. We plan on having a Gun shop/FFL. What do you want from your FFL that you're not currently getting?
Yes, I always am in need of a good shop, I would like to have a muzzle break added to my old Marlin .22 or upgrade my AR-15 trigger etc..

someone said snack bar would be nice, maybe something simple like vending machines.

I am currently a member at an outdoor range it's a 40 minute drive but the hours are limited so I don't always have a chance to go. so night shooting would be cool, lighted shooting pavilions and target stands.

last year I went to a Golf Driving range called Top Golf, it's a driving range that offers the competition of sport meets. You can challenge your friends and family to addictive point-scoring golf games, well why not have some competition shooting / scoring. some times just shooting a couple hundred rounds it not very fun after a while.

[trailrunner]

I'm a little late to this discussion, but just wanted to add that I would enthusiastically support this. I've been a member of Gilberts-Sharpshooters off and on for 20 years now, and would love to have an alternative. They are OK, but a) I'm getting tired of shooting holes in paper while standing still; b) their restrictions on ammo; c) some of the wait times I've had to endure waiting for a lane; d) when they get super crowded with too many newbies crowded in a lane. Personally, I'm more of a pistol person, so 25 yards is fine with me -- if we can do so more tactical style shooting. That would be a dream come true for me, because, as I said, I'm a bit tired of shooting at paper. I've been considering joining Quantico Shooting Club, but they don't seem like they allow anything other than slow-fire against cardboard. (I could be wrong about this - I just got this impression from their website.)

I'm an annual member of Sharpshooters, so I would have no trouble being an annual member of your range (if the cost and benefit were appropriate, of course). I'd be a little hesitant about paying a large up-front fee until I get confidence that you will be around for a while and that I'll like your place. You could also offer discounts for people who volunteer to be RSOs, if your insurance would allow that and if you're comfortable with that.

About the other questions you ask: I don't use FFLs that much, so I don't really care about that. As far as a snack bar goes, those are not the easiest thing to get a permit for in FFX county, and would be a diversion for you. I can bring my own snack. No need for wi-fi. Just stick to doing the shooting part of this operation correctly.

[RO73]

Just an update. This has become quite the PITA. We have complied with all requests, documentation etc. but we are still getting some push back from our good public servants. We have more attorneys involved at this point, but we only have so much money to spend. We don't want to blow our funds on fighting this and having not come to fruition. I will keep you all posted. Thanks to all who contributed ideas.