Im thinking of proposing this law

[mstuff]

Proposed: Secure All Firearms Everywhere (SAFE)

Any resident of the commonwealth of Virginia, eligible for a concealed handgun permit under § 18.2-308, shall have the right to maintain a privately owned "unorganized militia armory" to store and/or possess any weapon commonly found among the people and of a type expected to be presented for service in the unorganized militia, (§ 44-1. Composition of militia), provided that the "unorganized militia armory" secure container meets the following:

1- The "unorganized militia armory" is a device which has been certified, at a minimum, to have met the Underwriters Laboratory "Residential Security Container" certification.

2- The contents of the "unorganized militia armory" are limited to those that are expected to be found commonly among the people for their use when participating in the activities of the unorganized militia.

3- The "unorganized militia armory" container must be externally labeled "Virginia Unorganized Militia Armory"

4- The locking mechanism of a key, combination and/or biometric design will only be made available to other persons who are also eligible for a concealed handgun permit under § 18.2-308

5- Weapons, magazines, ammunition and/or ammunition production equipment and supplies are limited to those that are not prohibited to the unorganized militia by the laws of the commonwealth. Any statute seeking to limit any Weapons, magazines, ammunition and/or ammunition production equipment and supplies from any "unorganized militia armory" must specifically state that the limitation applies to any "unorganized militia armory".

A- Any person, under this section, that creates, possesses or maintains a privately owned and placarded "unorganized militia armory" in violation of this section will be found guilty of a class 1 misdemeanor unless that person or persons are found to be in possession of any privately owned "unorganized militia armory" under section B.

B- Any unauthorized person that burglarizes and/or transports any privately owned "unorganized militia armory" will be guilty of a class 1 felony.

Comments ?

[VBshooter]

No permit required is the way any law should be..Once you restrict the govmint can manipulate it.

[allingeneral]

Change this:

eligible for a concealed handgun permit under § 18.2-308

to this:

lawfully allowed to own a firearm

Do you really think there's *any* chance that they will codify an "Unorganized Militia" law?

[ShotgunBlast]

I guess I don't see the point of this. Why would I want to store my weapons somewhere else when I can store them in my house? At my house I have far fewer people that come and go compared to anyone with a CHP rummaging through this place.

[mstuff]

No permit required is the way any law should be..Once you restrict the govmint can manipulate it.

NO PERMIT IS REQUIRED WITHIN THE LAW I PROPOSE
-----------------------------------
Change this:
eligible for a concealed handgun permit under § 18.2-308
to this:
lawfully allowed to own a firearm

I PURPOSELY AUTHORED IT IN THAT MANNER SO THAT ONLY A PERSON WHO IS 21 AND ELIGIBLE FOR A PERMIT COULD HAVE A ARMORY THAT IS PROTECTED UNDER THE LAW
Nothing in this prevents anyone user 21 from having a gun safe or guns, the safe just cant be placarded as a MILITIA ARMORY
One reason is if you came to the aid of an armory under threat, you would be more assured that it was a legally possessed armory and not that of a drug dealer felon etc

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I guess I don't see the point of this. Why would I want to store my weapons somewhere else when I can store them in my house? At my house I have far fewer people that come and go compared to anyone with a CHP rummaging through this place.

NOTHING IN THIS PROPOSAL STATES THAT ARMORY IS, OR IS NOT, IN YOUR HOUSE, PLACE OF BUSINESS, OR THE MOON

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Do you really think there's *any* chance that they will codify an "Unorganized Militia" law?

THATS THE UNDERLYING GOAL, IF THEY DID, WOULD BE HARD TO SEIZE THE CONTENTS OF A "WELL REGULATED MILITIA" THAT HAS BEEN CODIFIED BY THE STATE
I mean, wouldnt other militia have a responsibility to come to the aid of other state recognized armorys that were under threat from some non-state entity ?

[FiremanBob]

You are obviously not a lawyer. I can't support the proposal as drafted. Why do you think a UL certified safety container is a good thing?

[mstuff]

Because its a STANDARD

I didnt say it was good or bad

[mstuff]

You are obviously not a lawyer.

sooo, u wud only vote for someone thats a "lawyer"

[FiremanBob]

No, but I can't support a bill that isn't clear or one that seems to limit rights I already have. Are you perhaps in the business of selling "Residential Security Containers"?

1. What's so great about an official "standard"? It's someone's idea of an official credential. Zero has the official credentials of a lawyer, but that doesn't mean he respects the Constitution any more than Putin does.

2. What is the purpose of this "militia armory"? What do you expect it to contain besides the firearms and ammunition that we have now? Is your purpose to permit automatic or other military weapons? Otherwise, what does it permit that VA law doesn't already permit?

3. The last item, making a felony to transport "militia armory" material, would apply to the lawful owner of that material transporting it, for example, to the range for "militia training". That's the kind of sloppy drafting I was referring to.

My position is simple: There hasn't been a sensible firearms law passed in this country since the day after the ratification of the Second Amendment. We don't need more detailed restrictions and regulations. We need to restore the values and principles of our American culture.

[SHMIV]

No. Too many restrictions and requirements. Other than that, the proposal is redundant.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[moss20]

The 2nd. Amendment -- end of story. All other laws and regulations concerning firearms, knives, etc. are unconstitutional and should be abolished!

[DryBones]

storing munitions in a centralized location...didn't they try that in Concord, MA a few hundred years ago? Let's ask Paul Revere....

http://www.eyewitnesstohistory.com/lexington.htm

[mstuff]

1. What's so great about an official "standard"? It's someone's idea of an official credential. Zero has the official credentials of a lawyer, but that doesn't mean he respects the Constitution any more than Putin does.
BECAUSE WITHOUT SOME REFERENCE STANDARD OTHERS THAT SEE A STANDARD LACKING COULD INSERT A STANDARD SUCH AS TTL-15 WHICH WOULD MAKE THE COST OF THE CONTAINER 10 TIMES MORE

2. What is the purpose of this "militia armory"? What do you expect it to contain besides the firearms and ammunition that we have now? Is your purpose to permit automatic or other military weapons? Otherwise, what does it permit that VA law doesn't already permit?
TO CONTAIN "UNORGANIZED MILITIA" ARMS AMMO (the stuff you may have tight now and may consider unorganized militia arms and ammo)

3. The last item, making a felony to transport "militia armory" material, would apply to the lawful owner of that material transporting it, for example, to the range for "militia training". That's the kind of sloppy drafting I was referring to.
SENTENCE STARTS WITH "Any unauthorized person"

My position is simple: There hasn't been a sensible firearms law passed in this country since the day after the ratification of the Second Amendment. We don't need more detailed restrictions and regulations. We need to restore the values and principles of our American culture.
THERE'S NOT ONE RESTRICTION IN THAT PROPOSED STATUTE OTHER THAN THAT APPLIED TO PERSON(S) THAT BURGLE OR STEAL YOUR GUNSAFE

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No. Too many restrictions and requirements. Other than that, the proposal is redundant.
I DONT SEE ONE RESTRICTION IN THAT PROPOSAL OTHER THAN THAT LEVIED ON A BURGLAR

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The 2nd. Amendment -- end of story. All other laws and regulations concerning firearms, knives, etc. are unconstitutional and should be abolished!
NICE POSITION BUT I LIVE IN GUN GRABBING REALITY WITH ONLY THE MILITIA AND LAWS TO PROTECT MY WEAPONS AND AMMO

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storing munitions in a centralized location...didn't they try that in Concord, MA a few hundred years ago? Let's ask Paul Revere....
THIS CHANGES NOTHING IN HOW YOU STORE THOSE ITEMS TODAY, NOR DOES IT LIMIT YOU TO STORING THOSE ITEMS IN ANY SINGLE OR ANY DISCLOSED LOCATION

[mstuff]

seems i MAY be a pretty good lawyer after all

Everyone has totally missed the purpose and BENEFIT this proposal will provide against a gun grabbing leftist federalist in a State that has a constitutionally mandated unorganized militia

[mstuff]

Do you really think there's *any* chance that they will codify an "Unorganized Militia" law?
THERE ALREADY IS CODIFIED UNORGANIZED MILITIA LAW FOR QUITE SOME TIME IN THE STATE STATUTES

Aside from making the unorganized militia something more than a "potential force" this moves the individuals of that entity into the public eye. Also, since they are not going to issue you badges id and uniforms, by taking advantage of the current "wave" especially the elements that point to certain types of weapons being easily available to unauthorized persons, and/or unsecured, this takes advantage of that perceived fault.

By having access to this device as a tool, the citizens in effect become a recognized "state actor".

By utilizing this tool, the contents of the device are further protected from Federal control by the second amendment and previous USSC decisions regarding the militia and the weapons of the militia

[mstuff]

Virginia Militia

VA Constitution

Section 13. Militia; standing armies; military subordinate to civil power.
That a well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper, natural, and safe defense of a free state, therefore, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed; that standing armies, in time of peace, should be avoided as dangerous to liberty; and that in all cases the military should be under strict subordination to, and governed by, the civil power.

§ 44-1. Composition of militia.
The militia of the Commonwealth of Virginia shall consist of all able-bodied residents of the Commonwealth who are citizens of the United States and all other able-bodied persons resident in the Commonwealth who have declared their intention to become citizens of the United States, who are at least 16 years of age and, except as hereinafter provided, not more than 55 years of age. The militia shall be divided into four classes: the National Guard, which includes the Army National Guard and the Air National Guard; the Virginia Defense Force; the naval militia; and the unorganized militia.

§ 44-4. Composition of unorganized militia.
The unorganized militia shall consist of all able-bodied persons as set out in § 44-1, except such as may be included in §§ 44-2, 44-3, and 44-54.6, and except such as may be exempted as hereinafter provided.

§ 44-6. Maintenance of other troops.
In time of peace the Commonwealth shall maintain only such troops as may be authorized by the President of the United States; but nothing in this chapter shall be construed as limiting the rights of the Commonwealth in the use of the Virginia National Guard or Virginia Defense Force within or without its borders in time of peace and nothing contained in this chapter shall prevent the organization and maintenance of State Police or constabulary.

§ 44-8. Governor as Commander in Chief.
The Governor shall be Commander in Chief of the armed forces of the Commonwealth, and shall have power to employ such forces to repel invasion, suppress insurrection, and enforce the execution of the laws.

§ 44-9. Commander in Chief to prescribe regulations.
The Commander in Chief shall have the power, and it shall be his duty, from time to time, to issue such orders and to prescribe such regulations relating to the organization of the armed forces of the Commonwealth as will cause the same at all times to conform to the federal requirements of the United States government relating thereto.

§ 44-80. Order in which classes of militia called into service.
The National Guard, the Virginia Defense Force, the naval militia, and the unorganized militia or any part thereof may be ordered into service by the Governor in such order as he determines

§ 44-87. Manner of ordering out for service.
The Governor shall, when ordering out the unorganized militia, designate the number to be so called. He may order them out either by calling for volunteers or by draft.

§ 44-88. Incorporation into the Virginia Defense Force.
Whenever the Governor orders out the unorganized militia or any part thereof, it shall be incorporated into the Virginia Defense Force until relieved from service.

§ 44-89. Draft of unorganized militia.
If the unorganized militia is ordered out by draft, the Governor shall designate the persons in each county and city to make the draft, and prescribe rules and regulations for conducting the same.

§ 44-90. Punishment for failure to appear.
Every member of the militia ordered out for duty, or who shall volunteer or be drafted, who does not appear at the time and place ordered, shall be liable to such punishment as a court-martial may direct.

§ 44-97. Exemption from arrest.
No person belonging to the Virginia National Guard, Virginia State Defense Force or the naval militia shall be arrested on any process issued by or from any civil officer or court, except in cases of felony or breach of the peace, while going to, remaining at or returning from any place at which he may be required to attend for military duty; nor in any case whatsoever while actually engaged in the performance of his military duties, except with the consent of his commanding officer.

§ 44-114.1. Orders transmitted to and through the Governor.
All orders from the federal government or any of its officers, agencies or departments to the state militia of Virginia, including the National Guard, the naval militia, and the unorganized militia which relate to the call, induction, drafting of Virginia state troops of any type or description, into the federal service for active duty or otherwise and withdrawing them from the control of the Governor of Virginia shall be first transmitted to and through the Governor of Virginia. The Governor, as commander in chief of the state militia, shall not approve, consent to, or concur in any such order which has not been transmitted as herein required.

§ 44-114.2. Governor to be notified of receipt of order; no action taken until his instructions complied with.
If the Adjutant General of Virginia, or during his absence, any of his assistants, or anyone else in the Department of Military Affairs of the Commonwealth of Virginia, either in a civilian or military status, shall receive an order of the nature required in § 44-114.1 to be transmitted to the Governor, he shall immediately notify the Governor of Virginia of such receipt and the contents of this order by the most expeditious means, and no action shall be taken by anyone towards notifying the individuals of organizations of the Virginia militia of the contents of such orders or directions received from the federal government on this subject by any of its agencies or representatives until the Governor has been first advised and instructions from him have been complied with fully.

§ 44-114.3. Orders void if transmitted to militia before Governor notified.
If the Adjutant General or anyone else in the Department of Military Affairs should receive such a message of the kind referred to in § 44-114.1 and fail to notify the Governor immediately, and subsequently transmits such orders, for the purpose of having such orders executed, to any personnel of the state militia, or to any person other than the Governor, then such order or orders shall be illegal, null and void.

§ 44-114.4. Governor not prevented from drafting into state military service.
Nothing in this article shall prevent the Governor from drafting all citizens into the state military service if he may so desire in accordance with the military laws of Virginia.

§ 44-117. Officers of Virginia Military Institute, the Virginia Women's Institute for Leadership at Mary Baldwin College, the Fishburne Military School, the Massanutten Military Academy, and Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University to be officers of militia.

The officers of the Virginia Military Institute, the Virginia Women's Institute for Leadership at Mary Baldwin College, the Fishburne Military School, the Massanutten Military Academy, and the Commandant of Cadets and Assistant Commandants of Cadets of the Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University shall be commissioned officers of the Virginia militia, unorganized, and subject to the orders of the Governor and the same rules and regulations as to discipline provided for other commissioned officers of the military organizations of the Commonwealth. The Governor is authorized and directed to issue commissions to the professors, assistant professors and other officers of the Virginia Military Institute, the Fishburne Military School, the Massanutten Military Academy, and the Virginia Women's Institute for Leadership at Mary Baldwin College, according to the rank prescribed by those institutions; and to the Commandant of Cadets and Assistant Commandants of Cadets of the Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University. Such persons shall be eligible to receive and to continue to hold such commissions, regardless of age, for so long as they continue to be officers, professors or assistant professors of the Virginia Military Institute, the Virginia Women's Institute for Leadership at Mary Baldwin College, the Fishburne Military School, the Massanutten Military Academy, or the Commandant of Cadets or Assistant Commandants of Cadets of Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University. The governing boards of each institution shall recommend to the Governor the rank to which such eligible persons shall be commissioned, but the following determination of such rank shall be made by the Governor. Commissions in such militia issued such persons by the Governor shall not entitle any person holding the same to any pay or emolument by reason thereof unless he be assigned to duty by order of the Governor with the Virginia National Guard; and in such event, the rank of such officer shall be relatively inferior to that of all other officers of the same grade in the Virginia National Guard.

[FiremanBob]

mstuff, it's a dumb idea and you have not demonstrated any benefit from it compared to the present state of VA law. I'm convinced that you don't know what you're talking about, so I'm done with this thread.

Even in the police state of NY, reports yesterday are that there is already massive civil resistance to the state's demand for firearm registration. We are not in "gun-grabbing reality" yet and we will not be, as long as we can say No to the fascist-wannabes.

[allingeneral]

I feel the need to point out that well-intended thought on the topic of our firearms laws, especially in an effort to protect them isn't all that "dumb". Perhaps this specific approach is misguided, perhaps it isn't...but having a thought and tossing it out to the community probably shouldn't result in someone calling your idea "dumb".

Just saying.

Carry on

[clayinva]

The 2nd. Amendment -- end of story. All other laws and regulations concerning firearms, knives, etc. are unconstitutional and should be abolished!

What he said. I'll take 3 bazookas, 2 50-cals and a tank.

[mstuff]

mstuff, it's a dumb idea and you have not demonstrated any benefit from it compared to the present state of VA law. I'm convinced that you don't know what you're talking about, so I'm done with this thread.

THE BENEFIT IS THAT THE ARMS IN THE MILITIA ARMORY OUGHT NOT TO BE A TARGET OF ANY FED LAW OR GRAB AND THAT ANY STATE RESTRICTION OF THEIR CONTENTS SHOULD BE SPECIFICALLY STATED AND NOT MERELY MIXED IN WITH OTHER EMOTIONAL OR POLITICALLY DRIVEN GUN LAWS FOR THE MASSES

ANY ATTEMPTS BY ANY AUTHORITY TO INFRINGE ON A STATE RECOGNIZED SECURE STORAGE DEVICE CONTAINING MILITIA ARMS COULD WOULD SHOULD BE MET WITH SOME FORM OF A RESPONSE, AS OPPOSED TO THE RESPONSE A LONE CITIZEN OF NY IN THE CATSKILLS MOUNTAINS MAY GET WHEN SOMEONE SHOWS UP THERE WITH A WARRANT FOR DOWNLOADING A PIRATED MOVIE WHICH QUICKLY BRANCHES OUT INTO A GUN GRAB DUE TO A FELONY MOVIE DOWNLOAD TO WHICH HIS SUPPORT GROUP MAY GO OH WELL THERE YOU GO THEY GOT HIM ON SOMETHING AND OH WELL I GUESS THEY CAN PICK UP THE GUNS OF A CHARGED FELON.

That's kind of the benefit