True? Police have records of ALL guns?

[Mindflayer]

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2012/1 ... -database/

Is this BS? True?

An eagle-eyed reader noticed this from commentator keltec9 at seattleguns.net (registration required, ironically enough). “I always thought the police did not know I had a cpl or that I owned firwarms in a stop, well I found out differently today. A good friend of mine is a former SPD and current bellevue PD took me for a ride today. He ran my plate whch brought up the registered owner, me…clicked on my license number which showed my photo, ss#, driving record, etc. Scroll down a little, motorcycle license, CPL #, WTF…CPL… Issue date, exp, issued by kc sheriff, then this shocked me most…A list of every firearm I own, model, serial, where I bought it WTF. I had no idea they had all this info. I still cant believe it.” The Firearms Owners Protection Act specifically forbids any local, state or federal agency from maintaining a firearms or firearms owners database.

[SpanishInquisition]

I don't think all that info goes out of state through NCIC, but states do have lots of latitude in what data they collect within their boundaries and provide to law enforcement through their data systems.

[GeneFrenkle]

I don't know about over there, but afaik in VA, the police only know you have a carry permit. Having said that, years ago Fairfax City used to require the Chief of Police to approve all in-city gun purchases, so who knows if they actually keep them. Something kind of interesting is, at least years ago, Orange County Police used to conduct safety/carry classes which required the make, model, and S/N of whatever firearm you brought.

It's very disappointing to think that the very agencies charged with enforcement being the main violators is becoming the norm rather than exception. I'm not sure I understand how individuals hiding behind a title can be isolated from real prosecution. I thought the CFR and other laws specified that no protections would be given for unlawful activities.

[Jakeiscrazy]

Calling BS, known a few officers talked guns with all of them and none said anything about this. The CHP thing is sometimes true but not the second half.

[donut]

All good ones start with the "Friend of a friend of mine whose cousin knew a guy who once sold a pair of boot laces to a Navy SEAL said that...."

Now, do local police have records, eh probably not, but can they request them? I bet they can. From where? Most likely the ATF or the State Police. Whenever you purchase a firearm you have to fill out the necessary paperwork. At that point your name and the serial number, make and model of that weapon are linked on paper. That stuff is recorded and kept on a transaction register. We d have to defer to a shop owner I know there are a few on these boards but, I don't think the ATF needs a warrant to inspect the register. So if they have a record of say which states you've lived in chances are a agent or trooper doing enough research can get a idea of what and how many of what you own. Do that by checking where and when you had your background check (shop and seller ID) called in from, swing down to the shop and check the register.

[SHMIV]

According to my buddy, he found that the VA State Police had a record of his gun purchases going back to the 80's. He discovered this when reporting a couple of guns that were stolen during a break-in.

[lizjimbo]

This is one reason to keep private sales private. All ffls are required by law to log all sales and keep a copy of all 4473 forms on file. If the ffl goes out of business the file of 4473s is to be turned over to batf. This should not be news

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[snatale42]

There's a difference between sales tracking, and registration. Of course there's a permanent record of the original FFL xfer, but that doesn't mean you still have it! Therefor it's pointless. In actual registration states they KNOW you have that gun. Even here where there is no registration, I like to have Bill of Sale's signed for that reason. If I was the original owner of a gun, my name will always be attached to that S/N at some level.

[dusterdude]

In 2004 i was stopped at a traffic stop in new kent,i had my springfield 45 in the car with me,i told the officer i had the gun in the car and he asked me to hand it to him,when i did he went to his car and ran the serial and of course it came back to me,all went well.the moral of this is,i bought the gun in 1988 and someone somewhere still had a record of it

[GettingOld]

In 2004 i was stopped at a traffic stop in new kent,i had my springfield 45 in the car with me,i told the officer i had the gun in the car and he asked me to hand it to him,when i did he went to his car and ran the serial and of course it came back to me,all went well.the moral of this is,i bought the gun in 1988 and someone somewhere still had a record of it

I suspect that it was the opposite. There was no record of the serial, hence not crime connected.

[dusterdude]

No,i failed to mention that the cop had his radio on loudspeaker so i heard the whole exchange between him and the dispatcher.the dispatcher had all my info in front of her,i heard her tell the cop all the info about my gun

[scrubber3]

Wow. Lots of different stories going around in here huh? I'll stick around for the contact buzz. Lol

[mamabearCali]

mmmmmmm.......I always suspected that...now I know. Going to go with FTF transactions from here on out.

[scrubber3]

Best not believe everything you hear on the Internet mamabear.

[mamabearCali]

Yeah, but better to be safe than sorry too.....


edited to add I will ask my State Police buddy...he is one of the captains in the VA state police. He is an upfront fellow and if he can't tell me he will say that and if he can he always tells the truth.

[Dreamerx4]

I am a dealer, and I would like to put this to bed, this is mostly crap....

When I do the background here in Virginia, they only know whether you are buying a pistol, revolver, shotgun, or rifle. (period) Unless you purchase multiple handguns, they have no idea what you specifically bought, nor is there a serial number linked to you. Nor do they know what ID's you are using during the background if I do it online, but that is a different topic.

You do fill out a 4473, and it has the model and serial number, but it goes nowhere but the FFL's possession for 20 years. If the FFL goes out of business, the records are forwarded to Martinsburg, WV. The state police do NOT have a record of any serial numbers belonging to anyone, unless it was during a multiple purchase.

They do have access to a stolen gun registry, but that only would come up if your gun was stolen, and you gave them the serial number.

Having folks say that serial numbers are tracked and in a database here in Virginia, is baseless and simply not true.

If a crime is committed, and a gun is recovered... The police will notify the ATF, the ATF contacts to manufacturer, then the wholesaler, then the FFL, and then they may find out who bought the gun, they will then contact the owner... if the owner sold the gun and does not know any more than the purchaser was a VA resident, and said they were legal to possess a firearm, well the well dries up and that is that.

So, unless you buy multiple handguns, that are reported to the ATF and State Police by the end of business that day, recording make model and serial number, no agency has any idea of what you bought specifically.

Hope this helps clear the air a bit.

Doug

[dusterdude]

So doug,what you're saying is,if a cop runs the serial on a gun,all they can find out is whether or not its stolen and that is all?

[Dreamerx4]

There is simply no other way they would have the information on a particular firearm.

I have many firearms come through and go out, and know that at no point does the state have the information, UNLESS, you purchase more than one handgun in 5 day period. At that point a multiple sales for is filled out, and faxed in to the ATF and State Police by the end of business. That form will have the model, make and serial number along with who purchased it. I do not have information for how long that document is maintained by the State Police.

The serial number is on the 4473, and is available at my business for the ATF to see whenever they want, but that is the only way they could know what you bought, and had at one point.

[lizjimbo]

Doug...what you said is that the firearm is traceable to the original purchaser and that the ffl must keep records for 20 years. Sure sounds like "registration". I don't believe for one moment that the VSP firearm transaction center does not keep a data base. If some one from the VSPFTC will tell me otherwise I would appreaciate that greatly!

[Dreamerx4]

The VSP does not receive the serial number or even what you bought... unless you buy multiple handguns within a 5 day period.

They simply know you are buying A pistol, revolver, rifle, or shotgun. How many of each is all they get, period. They are supposed to destroy the SP-65 after 30 days... even if they do not, they still do not have a serial number linked to the buyer.

No one has the records of the serial number except the FFL. They just do not get the number.

Is that registration, you could argue it is, however, the original purchaser can sell the firearm, and the trail is lost. Gone, no more.

Unless the firearm is used in a crime, or turns up for whatever reason, there is no police record of it.

Now, if the government ever wanted to confiscate firearms, they could perhaps come to the FFL's, and seize the records, and then contact buyers of said firearms, but again, who knows what happens after the firearm goes home.