Very Bad Experiance Virginia Center Commons Mall Glenn Allen

[KennyS]

Don't Give your buisness to Virginia Center Commons Mall, Glenn Allen Va off Rout 1.

We went to Virginia Center Commons, as my daughter wanted to look for a home coming dress. I decided to enter the mall through the food court side. I knew there would probably be security at the door, but didn't know they had any issues with weapons carry. I guess he didn't notice my 1911 as I walked in because nothing was said, and than we walked buy a security guard half way through the court. He didn't immediately move or any thing, but I noticed he made a call on his radio, and mentioned to my wife here it comes. Sure enough as we got to the end of food court where the mall splits to both sides, here comes the Calvary from every direction on their lazy mobile two wheel scooters. The first one approached and rudely said this is private property and weapons are not allowed. He wouldn't even look me in the eye. I said I didn't see any any gun signs on the door and told me it was on the mall policy plaque’s on either side of the vestibule on the way in. At that time he told me if I wanted to put my weapon back in the vehicle I could precede into the mall. I politely informed him, if I could not carry there, I would take my business else where.
I will tell you, I am really ticked off at the way they handled this as it seemed like they were treating me like a criminal. Aside from the older white guard which seemed to be apologetic and professional, the other three were totally rude and what seemed to be on the verge of combative. I noticed one that had walked up on the back of me a few feet away, and I thought for a second, he was going to try and disarm me and this is a no no. After I finally realized that they were not going to try to detain me, I turned around and headed for the door. On the way out, I noticed the plaque and did see in small writing hidden in the middle of every other rule no weapons allowed. I will get my wife to take a picture of it tomorrow on the way home from church so I can post it. Lastly after exiting the mall, the guard that was on post when I walked in was still there and two more different ones in uniforms showed up as well as one in plain clothes. As well on my walk back to the truck, we were followed buy a couple in their security vehicle; they waited till we got to the truck, and as well followed me out of the parking lot.

[zephyp]

Precisely the reason I dont use the Springfield mall. Its crime city and no carry allowed. Plenty of other malls and stores here in NOVA and if I dont see a sign I dont worry. Btw, I never open carry here unless forced to do so in a restaurant and we dont eat out very often...

[KennyS]

Never really had any other issues at any of the other stores or restaurants in the area. I OC Walmart, Fool Lion, and a lot of places regularly. I OC more in the summer as I don't want the extra clothing. Winter CC no problemo. I very seldom even have bad reactions from costumers, sometimes it leads to good conversation.

[Dragonfly]

For that very reason I have transitioned to a Bellyband Holster. If needbe I can slide it down if needed for ABC Restaurants. This thing works great with my PM9 or XD40 Sub compact.

[KennyS]

I have tried about everything, but from prior back surgeries, as well as needing another one the only comfortable way for me is on a belt, as it pulls down and is not as restrictive. I could as well have another shirt cover, but sometimes at even 60 degrees I have an extream sweat problem with the extra clothing. I look at it this way; why sneek around like a teenager drinking in the woods. I am legal and law says I can do it. Why do we go to great efforts to keep gun pro laws if we are not going to use them? I dont meen it as hey look at me I am big and bad with a gun as well there are other reasons as well. Some criminols are for what they can steal, with a gun only as intimidation. They walk in see a gun change their mind, go some where else. Same could be said for someone that just wants to hurass. I have had a lot of friendly conversations come out of open carry. As well it visualy shows responsible gun ownership that puts down some of the bad so many like to put on us.

[VBshooter]

Isn't it amazing what a little authority does to some people.. Most mall guards?? I see are about as threatening as a kid in a halloween costume,, But get em in a group and their all suddenly RAMBO,,, you note their usual tactics of having 2,3 ,or 4 at a situation to bolster each others bravado,,Sadly our common sense has to rule when you feel like just smacking one of em that so obvioulsly needs it. I wonder what they'd do if several OC'ers came in at once? Call out the National Guard or State Police Swat?

[KennyS]

Mabe a poor choice of words on my part, but the only way to explain their reaction and rudeness was; white redneck radical racist with a gun. If they went after those that broke mall rules with the language, horse play,loitering as well those in the parking lot that hang over patrons cars and such the same way they rudely dealt with me, I would say it is just the way they conduct themselves. In this case it seemed like more.

[VBshooter]

Hopefully in the future it won; happen to you gain but if it does , If your cell phone can record set it to do so and let em talk while you keep your cool and get as much of their BS recorded as possible,,That will give you some leverage in case you decide to push back legally at a late time.. It sucks having to be humble in that situation but the wrong kind of resistance can really get ya screwed!!

[Vahunter]

Mabe a poor choice of words on my part, but the only way to explain their reaction and rudeness was; white redneck radical racist with a gun.

I would agree it's a poor choice of words. Leave out the "racist" and you have described me. I think radical sounds better than anal which my wife uses to describe me.

[KennyS]

Just repeating what the media likes to say about a white man with a gun. It as well seemed that the guards feel the same way.
About the anal, my wife too.

[CBEEZO]

VBshooter, you said something about security in numbers to bolster bravado?
Understand that I am a security officer and I know that mall. Security Officers respond in numbers because they don't know you. You may be and even Kenny S may be law abiding citizens but how many people are not?
Nobody is racial profiling or stereotyping. Those rules exist as umbrella rules to include everybody. NO one except law enforcment officers and money carriers are allowed to carry weapons into a mall.
I would think that as proud gun owners and maybe CWL holders you all would know the rules as to when and where you can carry.
Private property owners dictate who can carry on private property.
This suprecedes your second amendment right. I look forward to more discussion with you.

[KennyS]

Not all malls across the country are no gun. As well if they are not well posted you have no Idea, especialy when you have open carried there many times in the past with no issues. As well I understand that you say they dont know you but come on, I was in there with my wife, daughter, and son. Yes they may have had the need to find out who I was, but dont disrespect me from the get go, and as well dont send one of your cronies behind me like you are going to attack me from the rear.

If you know this mall, than I guess you know how these gards can cut up and make loud comments that the publick can hear. It is no secret with them that there are a few there that openly admit they want to impress the girls as well. Sorry but I dont buy the whole thing. Most of them want to show them selves being important but many of their actions show them as un-perfessional.

[mamabearCali]

VBshooter, you said something about security in numbers to bolster bravado?
Understand that I am a security officer and I know that mall. Security Officers respond in numbers because they don't know you. You may be and even Kenny S may be law abiding citizens but how many people are not?
Nobody is racial profiling or stereotyping. Those rules exist as umbrella rules to include everybody. NO one except law enforcment officers and money carriers are allowed to carry weapons into a mall.
I would think that as proud gun owners and maybe CWL holders you all would know the rules as to when and where you can carry.
Private property owners dictate who can carry on private property.
This suprecedes your second amendment right. I look forward to more discussion with you.

If the powers that be do not want us to carry in a particular mall I have two things to say

#1 Post it better and more conspicuously. If it is in miniscule script on a plaque outside the door then no one read it. Other places that do not wish to have weapons put that policy in big bold letters--not tiny script. If I don't see a sign--I can't be expected to abide by a property owners wishes.

#2 If the store is posted conspicuously, expect to get less business from law abiding citizens and more business from criminals who now KNOW the entire populace there is without any defense. I am not taking my three precious children to a place where I am defenseless against the more sinister elements of society.

Just so you know, those who intend on doing bad things with their weapons don't give a rats tail about the sign and are going to do what they are going to do anyway. Now you just have less help when that happens.

On VA center commons.

I stopped going to this particular mall when 7 years ago I was picked up and thrown into a store display while noticeably pregnant by 5 thugs. The only thing I had done was standing in the lobby of a door they wanted to pass by. Had they said anything I would have moved, I figured I was out of their way. I guess I looked like a nice juicy target to have fun with. Did the security guards do anything then--no they sat there and laughed at me as I tried to explain to hallmark why I was in their display. Did they stop the hooligans--no--the hooligans were likely armed and they of course were not so they did a big fat 0. Don't go to this mall. You are not permitted to defend yourself and the security guards are not going to help you either.

[CBEEZO]

Wow, I am sorry you had to be subjected to that. Most of the people I know have only worked there in the last five. I will agree though that a much larger sign in bold print would help as far reducing the number of and I hesitate to use this word but "confrontations" with law abiding gun owners.
Still the idea of having armed people in a place open to the public who are willing to use weapons so freely in what seems to be any situation where they feel threatend is a bit much than property owners are willing to deal with.
Thankfully you are well and I am glad your children are as well.

[KennyS]

Wow, I am sorry you had to be subjected to that. Most of the people I know have only worked there in the last five. I will agree though that a much larger sign in bold print would help as far reducing the number of and I hesitate to use this word but "confrontations" with law abiding gun owners.
Still the idea of having armed people in a place open to the public who are willing to use weapons so freely in what seems to be any situation where they feel threatend is a bit much than property owners are willing to deal with.
Thankfully you are well and I am glad your children are as well.

Ok now this is where you are not making sence. You seem to think the law obiding will use there wepons freely in any situation? If you were to say would not hesitate to use their weapon in a life or death situation I would than agree, but in the way you said it I disagree. When I put on my weapon either conceiled or non, my hope is I should never have to use it. If I do it is only for a dire life or death situation. Saying that there have been a few times I have not conceiled that it did serve as a deturant.

[CBEEZO]

Don't get me wrong. It sounded as if the other person was saying "oh if people are mean to me or i feel threatend or to avoid being mistreated"
That is how I took it. I understand that most people with guns are not going to just walk around like "I HAVE A GUN SO NOBODY MESSES WITH ME!"
But see my point here...being called paul blart and making fun of security officers because they take precautions when dealing with armed people, you simply misunderstand. I think if you want to carry and it's legal and if you carry concealed and it's legal, fine no problems here. Hell I grew up in texas there are guns everywhere. All I am looking for is common ground where you as a gun owner can understand that yes security takes issue with people with guns in a place open to the public. YES, we understand citizens have the right to carry. WE all agree that it should be posted larger and more visible. Can we agree that as adults we can refrain from childish name calling and act like adults? I will agree that some officers probably need more training as far as customer service and comminucation skills go. What do you think?

[mamabearCali]

Still the idea of having armed people in a place open to the public who are willing to use weapons so freely in what seems to be any situation where they feel threatend is a bit much than property owners are willing to deal with.

All I am looking for is common ground where you as a gun owner can understand that yes security takes issue with people with guns in a place open to the public. YES, we understand citizens have the right to carry.

Since you are from Texas (as I am too) I will tell you how it is here. In TX you may only carry concealed. In VA you may carry openly or concealed with a permit. Texas while appearing to be in some ways very friendly to guns has much more of a "don't ask don't tell policy" in regard to carrying guns.

The first quote boggles my mind--people who carry guns legally do so to respond only to lethal threats. If the property owner values my life so little as to say that I should not be permitted to defend my life then I shall simply take my business elsewhere.

On the second quote. The OP was treated really badly. If security guards do not want to be called names then they should learn to treat people better and not act like that.

There is not going to be much common ground here on security being nervous with CHL holder and open carriers because of 3 facts. #1 You are never ever going to stop the thugs, those intent on doing harm from carrying a gun into the mall. #2 Criminal elements will always exist within society #3 Security is not going to protect my family in a lethal situation--heck the police don't even do that 99% of the time. So property owners can stop law abiding gun owners from coming into the property (and most will avoid places they are not welcome), but all they have done is made it easier for the criminals to get away with crime.

[KennyS]

Don't get me wrong. It sounded as if the other person was saying "oh if people are mean to me or i feel threatend or to avoid being mistreated"
That is how I took it. I understand that most people with guns are not going to just walk around like "I HAVE A GUN SO NOBODY MESSES WITH ME!"
But see my point here...being called paul blart and making fun of security officers because they take precautions when dealing with armed people, you simply misunderstand. I think if you want to carry and it's legal and if you carry concealed and it's legal, fine no problems here. Hell I grew up in texas there are guns everywhere. All I am looking for is common ground where you as a gun owner can understand that yes security takes issue with people with guns in a place open to the public. YES, we understand citizens have the right to carry. WE all agree that it should be posted larger and more visible. Can we agree that as adults we can refrain from childish name calling and act like adults? I will agree that some officers probably need more training as far as customer service and comminucation skills go. What do you think?

Places open to the public are better targets for criminals, especaly when they know you do not have an individual right to protect yourself.
As was said earlier, there was no conspicuious sign any where, and at that fact they did not have it even posted on their web site. I as well believe that also it is still only at one of the many entrances.

I was dressed well, past one gard in front before entering at the food court no issue, walked in and as another older guard looked at me I smiled and nodded. Next thing I know I was being rudely yelled at and surounded by nonsence.


Not that there are not a couple responsible guards there, but the majority lacked respect, as well as lack of training. If they would have proceived me to be a threat, they screwed up in the mannor that they acted because that could have made a psyco go of the deep end and harming many innocent people. As well by announcing loudly if you want to come into this mall you need to leave your gun in the care announced where someone could have stole a ungarded fire arm had I havve been stupid enough to say.

I have seen people in this mall breaking the written rules, but saying that if the guards know them thats allowed, at the same time I have seen people the gards havnt known do similar and get the riot act read to them or thrown out. Language also tells me alot, with some of the language and comments these gards use it is easy to tell why they are security gards and not cops. Loudly talking amoungst themselvs on who they are going to impress next. I will not post hear say hear as I did not hear it with my own ears but others as well have have told me things that add up to the barny badd as wanna be cop presonna that some of them project directly.

[CBEEZO]

I agree that a few bad eggs have ruined the perception for security officers. I agree with your first two facts and as far as the third I hate to say it but you are right. In a lethal situation security officers are directed to help who they can and not put themselves in harms way unecessarily. I get that you would want to protect yourself and family in a situation like that however, complaining about it to officers or even calling them names does no good. OK so you people made to leave feel better walking out saying something like"oh you are just paul blart, or go joy ride on your little scooter." What does this accomplish when security is just enforcing the rules imposed by the owners?
I guess it makes them feel bigger and better?
The people you should be talking to are the property owners. Whether it's right or wrong it is just how the rules are. Those officers are doing what the owner wants them to do and if it means losing your business then they will suffer not gun owners.

[mk4]

...snip...
All I am looking for is common ground where you as a gun owner can understand that yes security takes issue with people with guns in a place open to the public.
...snip...
I will agree that some officers probably need more training as far as customer service and comminucation skills go. What do you think?

- how about taking 'issue' with the miscreants/thugs/punks that terrorize people just trying to go about their business? it seems this particular mall's security staff takes little/no issue with the real problem.

- some of them need be trained on how not to escalate a situation with a law-abiding citizen. what i can't fathom is the attempt to get behind the op, with any consideration of forcibly and illegally disarming him. the attempt would be far more likely to result in a really bad situation. far more likely than, say, the law-abiding oc'er going about his peaceful business.

all this considered, as others have stated, as long as the private property owner's policy is well-posted so i have a reasonable chance of complying, i'm happy to take my business elsewhere. i'm curious, though. why did you choose to join the forum just to dig up a 2 year old post?

eta: also odd that you chose to join ocdo to dig up the op's 2 year old post over there also. what are your motives?