Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

Anyone here happen to know what the restrictions are on firearm ownership in Norway? I would like to think that something of that scale would be very unlikely in a place like Virginia.

Firearms restrictions are pretty tight in Norway.

I think something like that definitely could happen in Virginia. If you had a large concentration of young people (read: under the age to legally carry a handgun) with no police or armed security presence that'd give an active shooter enough time to do some serious damage.

From what I understand with the Utoya island case is there was no police or security presence, so it took quite some time before police could respond and make it to the island by boat. And by that time the guy was either out of ammunition or decided to surrender.

Makes me wonder why there was no security presence at an event with several hundred kids sponsored by the ruling government party... but I guess these questions will be answered or excuses will be made in the coming days.

Just don't expect this to spark any pro-firearms discussion in Norway... outside of hunting rifles I think that society is anti-gun and will likely blame the incident on the weapons used.

What a tragedy, though. I can't even imagine.

What's up with these nut-jobs and their manifestos?. Here's a link to the translated version.

http://tinyurl.com/3vgmlhb

Update: The video has been taken down by Youtube.

Obviously there is only one person (or group of people) that are truly at fault. Those who perpetrated this horrible attack.

That said it is really scary that when you disarm a whole group of people -a whole nation really--you take with it any notion of resistance other than fleeing. No one had a rock they could throw at this guy's head (or a series of rocks), or a baseball, or ten people sneak up behind him and hit him with baseball bats/metal pipes. All of those can kill too. But no one thought of it--they just ran and died. I know before I was a CHL or was even interested with it I would go places totally unarmed and just not think about it. When I started to think about defense even when I have had to be in areas that required me to go unarmed I have always had something that I could conceivably use in a last ditch effort. Even if in a federal building it is nothing more than a soda can and a sharp pen, still it would be better than having nothing at all. I am not blaming those poor kids, just wishing that perhaps a few of the adult's/older children had been in a mind set that would allow them to think of a way to stop the attack.


Additionally I am not a LEO, so I probably just don't get it but I don't understand how you sit there on the other shore knowing kids are dying and have no way to defend themselves, and you know you might be able to end it and you stay on the other shore and wait for swat. Again, not the LEO's fault for the kids being killed, but I wish that someone would have had the mind set to stop this guy even at personal risk.

m4a1mustang wrote:Makes me wonder why there was no security presence at an event with several hundred kids sponsored by the ruling government party... but I guess these questions will be answered or excuses will be made in the coming days.

Why should there have been? No one would attack a government brainwashing facility! I mean, summer camp.

What stuns me is how utterly helpless everyone on that island was. They outnumber the guy hundreds to one, but they all ran away, devil take the hindmost. Sad. I sure hope it wasn't really that bad, that the initial reportage is wrong as is so often the case, and at least a few of them had the balls to try to stop their own murder.

Diomed wrote:

m4a1mustang wrote:Makes me wonder why there was no security presence at an event with several hundred kids sponsored by the ruling government party... but I guess these questions will be answered or excuses will be made in the coming days.

Why should there have been? No one would attack a government brainwashing facility! I mean, summer camp.

What stuns me is how utterly helpless everyone on that island was. They outnumber the guy hundreds to one, but they all ran away, devil take the hindmost. Sad. I sure hope it wasn't really that bad, that the initial reportage is wrong as is so often the case, and at least a few of them had the balls to try to stop their own murder.

Close to engage with anything and everything you have.

Many of the victims ran towards the murderer, who was dressed as a cop. Blind faith in even the trappings of authority is seldom rewarded kindly. Its noteworthy the actual cops sat idly by playing with themselves while he was doing his thing, much as they do here in America when presented with a real threat.

Still though, one guy took out, what 97 people? I'm impressed in a perverse way. Nordic ingenuity I guess.

Kreutz wrote:Many of the victims ran towards the murderer, who was dressed as a cop. Blind faith in even the trappings of authority is seldom rewarded kindly. Its noteworthy the actual cops sat idly by playing with themselves while he was doing his thing, much as they do here in America when presented with a real threat.

Still though, one guy took out, what 97 people? I'm impressed in a perverse way. Nordic ingenuity I guess.

Don't think I would consider dressing up as a cop and shooting a bunch of defenseless teenagers at a camp a display of ingenuity anymore than I would a suicide bomb.

caps85 wrote:

Kreutz wrote:Many of the victims ran towards the murderer, who was dressed as a cop. Blind faith in even the trappings of authority is seldom rewarded kindly. Its noteworthy the actual cops sat idly by playing with themselves while he was doing his thing, much as they do here in America when presented with a real threat.

Still though, one guy took out, what 97 people? I'm impressed in a perverse way. Nordic ingenuity I guess.

Don't think I would consider dressing up as a cop and shooting a bunch of defenseless teenagers at a camp a display of ingenuity anymore than I would a suicide bomb.

+1

Kreutz wrote:Many of the victims ran towards the murderer, who was dressed as a cop. Blind faith in even the trappings of authority is seldom rewarded kindly. Its noteworthy the actual cops sat idly by playing with themselves while he was doing his thing, much as they do here in America when presented with a real threat.

Still though, one guy took out, what 97 people? I'm impressed in a perverse way. Nordic ingenuity I guess.

His 1500+ page manifesto is available online. I skimmed through some of it last night and gathered that the guy was really an evil genius. Educated, thoughtful, thorough... he spent 5 years and almost 300,000 Euros planning for this "operation." It was sickeningly interesting I have to say. I hear he's set to appear in court on Monday.

Fundamentalism is bad.

m4a1mustang wrote:

Kreutz wrote:Many of the victims ran towards the murderer, who was dressed as a cop. Blind faith in even the trappings of authority is seldom rewarded kindly. Its noteworthy the actual cops sat idly by playing with themselves while he was doing his thing, much as they do here in America when presented with a real threat.

Still though, one guy took out, what 97 people? I'm impressed in a perverse way. Nordic ingenuity I guess.

His 1500+ page manifesto is available online. I skimmed through some of it last night and gathered that the guy was really an evil genius. Educated, thoughtful, thorough... he spent 5 years and almost 300,000 Euros planning for this "operation." It was sickeningly interesting I have to say. I hear he's set to appear in court on Monday.

One way to deal with all that planning - have him drawn and quartered tomorrow at dawn.
Goodbye, sucker!

Well they need to torture him first to see if he had any help along the way.

caps85 wrote:

Kreutz wrote:Many of the victims ran towards the murderer, who was dressed as a cop. Blind faith in even the trappings of authority is seldom rewarded kindly. Its noteworthy the actual cops sat idly by playing with themselves while he was doing his thing, much as they do here in America when presented with a real threat.

Still though, one guy took out, what 97 people? I'm impressed in a perverse way. Nordic ingenuity I guess.

Don't think I would consider dressing up as a cop and shooting a bunch of defenseless teenagers at a camp a display of ingenuity anymore than I would a suicide bomb.

His kill ratio set a new high score for the psycho shooter hall of fame.

And he faces a maximum sentence of 20 years (SERIOUSLY!) under Norwegian law, so....this guy kind of pulled off what he wanted too.

Kreutz wrote: And he faces a maximum sentence of 20 years (SERIOUSLY!) under Norwegian law, so....this guy kind of pulled off what he wanted too.

Unacceptable!

Dude needs to be covered in honey and tied up to an ant hill.

TheGodfather wrote:

Kreutz wrote: And he faces a maximum sentence of 20 years (SERIOUSLY!) under Norwegian law, so....this guy kind of pulled off what he wanted too.

Unacceptable!

Dude needs to be covered in honey and tied up to an ant hill.

I was wrong, its 21 years, sorry.

Kreutz wrote:

TheGodfather wrote:

Kreutz wrote: And he faces a maximum sentence of 20 years (SERIOUSLY!) under Norwegian law, so....this guy kind of pulled off what he wanted too.

Unacceptable!

Dude needs to be covered in honey and tied up to an ant hill.

I was wrong, its 21 years, sorry.

Oh.............never mind then. Justice has been served.