Not that I would do it but I was just wondering... could one legally carry an MP5 or MP5K (semi-automatic SBRs) concealed if one has a CHP? Does the fact that it has a stock make a difference or does the MP5/MP5K have to be in pistol configuration for concealed carry?
Thanks,
-Gary
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Tue, 31 May 2011 20:23:20
by OakRidgeStars
In Virginia, only if it's considered to be a handgun.
Good luck with that one.
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Tue, 31 May 2011 20:25:53
by totes6
I am not a lawyer, but some pertinent sections from Virginia's code of law follows:
§ 18.2-287.4. Carrying loaded firearms in public areas prohibited; penalty.
It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a loaded (a) semi-automatic center-fire rifle or pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material and is equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine that will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition or designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer or equipped with a folding stock or (b) shotgun with a magazine that will hold more than seven rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is chambered on or about his person on any public street, road, alley, sidewalk, public right-of-way, or in any public park or any other place of whatever nature that is open to the public in the Cities of Alexandria, Chesapeake, Fairfax, Falls Church, Newport News, Norfolk, Richmond, or Virginia Beach or in the Counties of Arlington, Fairfax, Henrico, Loudoun, or Prince William.
The provisions of this section shall not apply to law-enforcement officers, licensed security guards, military personnel in the performance of their lawful duties, or any person having a valid concealed handgun permit or to any person actually engaged in lawful hunting or lawful recreational shooting activities at an established shooting range or shooting contest. Any person violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.
The exemptions set forth in § 18.2-308 shall apply, mutatis mutandis, to the provisions of this section.
§ 18.2-308. Personal protection; carrying concealed weapons; when lawful to carry.
...
M. For purposes of this section:
"Handgun" means any pistol or revolver or other firearm, except a machine gun, originally designed, made and intended to fire a projectile by means of an explosion of a combustible material from one or more barrels when held in one hand.
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Tue, 31 May 2011 20:50:37
by programmatore
totes6 wrote:I am not a lawyer, but some pertinent sections from Virginia's code of law follows:
§ 18.2-287.4. Carrying loaded firearms in public areas prohibited; penalty.
It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a loaded (a) semi-automatic center-fire rifle or pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material and is equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine that will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition or designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer or equipped with a folding stock or (b) shotgun with a magazine that will hold more than seven rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is chambered on or about his person on any public street, road, alley, sidewalk, public right-of-way, or in any public park or any other place of whatever nature that is open to the public in the Cities of Alexandria, Chesapeake, Fairfax, Falls Church, Newport News, Norfolk, Richmond, or Virginia Beach or in the Counties of Arlington, Fairfax, Henrico, Loudoun, or Prince William.
The provisions of this section shall not apply to law-enforcement officers, licensed security guards, military personnel in the performance of their lawful duties, or any person having a valid concealed handgun permit or to any person actually engaged in lawful hunting or lawful recreational shooting activities at an established shooting range or shooting contest. Any person violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.
The exemptions set forth in § 18.2-308 shall apply, mutatis mutandis, to the provisions of this section.
§ 18.2-308. Personal protection; carrying concealed weapons; when lawful to carry.
...
M. For purposes of this section:
"Handgun" means any pistol or revolver or other firearm, except a machine gun, originally designed, made and intended to fire a projectile by means of an explosion of a combustible material from one or more barrels when held in one hand.
I guess the question is whether an MP5 or MP5K that is semi-auto only is still considered a machinegun. I suspect it is for the purpose of this section of the code.
Thanks for the replies, guys.
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Tue, 31 May 2011 21:10:21
by Jakeiscrazy
Reminds of of this guy.
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Tue, 31 May 2011 21:25:27
by meak99
programmatore wrote:
I guess the question is whether an MP5 or MP5K that is semi-auto only is still considered a machinegun. I suspect it is for the purpose of this section of the code.
Thanks for the replies, guys.
I've been unsuccessfully trying to find the official definition of machine gun, but I am pretty sure a "semi-auto" ONLY firearm would not be considered a machine gun. I think you're only issue is that with a stock, it's an SBR, not a handgun, and therefore the CHP is not a valid means to conceal it. IANAL.
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Tue, 31 May 2011 21:40:16
by programmatore
Jakeiscrazy wrote:
Reminds of of this guy.
Haha! No, I was thinking something a lot more discreet.
meak99 wrote:I've been unsuccessfully trying to find the official definition of machine gun, but I am pretty sure a "semi-auto" ONLY firearm would not be considered a machine gun. I think you're only issue is that with a stock, it's an SBR, not a handgun, and therefore the CHP is not a valid means to conceal it. IANAL.
§ 18.2-308. Personal protection; carrying concealed weapons; when lawful to carry.
...
M. For purposes of this section:
"Handgun" means any pistol or revolver or other firearm, except a machine gun, originally designed, made and intended to fire a projectile by means of an explosion of a combustible material from one or more barrels when held in one hand.
Does a SBR qualify as an "other firearm"? Damn these things are confusing.
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Wed, 01 Jun 2011 10:06:31
by Reverenddel
So you're talking about walking around with a HK PDW in Semi-only?
It SEEMS to fit the definition.
And the definition of a "Machine gun" is pretty clear in the code.
It ain't a machine gun, it's a "SBR".
Funny how the "R" in that is just a friggin' stock.
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Fri, 17 Jun 2011 03:44:50
by Diomed
meak99 wrote:I've been unsuccessfully trying to find the official definition of machine gun, but I am pretty sure a "semi-auto" ONLY firearm would not be considered a machine gun.
COV 18.2-288 wrote:(1) "Machine gun" applies to any weapon which shoots or is designed to shoot automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger.
I think you're only issue is that with a stock, it's an SBR, not a handgun, and therefore the CHP is not a valid means to conceal it. IANAL.
Virginia does not like to consider that there are more kinds of firearms than pistols, rifles and shotguns. You may find some court cases that deal with "what x is"; don't waste your time asking the state police.
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Thu, 28 Jul 2011 18:59:20
by SELFDEFENSE
So it looks like the Draco AK pistol would be CHP eligible
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Thu, 28 Jul 2011 19:09:02
by OakRidgeStars
SELFDEFENSE wrote:So it looks like the Draco AK pistol would be CHP eligible
That could be somewhat fuzzy if it was concealed with a magazine capable of carrying more than 20 rounds of ammunition. But how would you go about concealing a Draco with a 30 round mag any way?.
On a related note, Classic Arms has the mini Draco's in stock now. Centerfire Systems has the slightly larger Draco's in stock too.
Re: Concealed carry a submachinegun (MP5/MP5K)?
Posted: Fri, 29 Jul 2011 01:04:51
by pedal_pusher
you could buy an HK SP89, good ones can be found on gunbroker from time to time.
