Greatest Moments in Liberal History
Posted: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 19:47:09
Freedom Isn't Free - Buy a Gun.
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In fairness your mostly right, but I don't have a problem with my low-flush toilet.ShortMan wrote:Yeah just so you know that was all utter complete bullshit.
The hybrid really does use much less gasoline and goes up and down hills just fine. And it IS an internal combustion engine, with a battery backup, so that 70% of potential energy which we've been wasting for over a hundred years can finally have some of it reclaimed. Thats why its called a hybrid and not an electric. Video maker should have criticized the nasty crap they need to make the batteries, which has no good argument at all.
The fluorescent bulb uses even less than 25% of the energy of its incandescent bulb counterpart, which means fewer of your precious wetlands plowed over to make new power plants. And it comes on instantly nowadays, and the disposal method is no worse than what the other bulbs were required to have, but people just got used to ignoring those instructions. I'm sure they will do the same with these ones as well.
And the main reason Obamacare is broke is because of what the conservatives did to it. But once again the guy making the video did not wanna acknowledge that.
The only one that was dead on was the low-flow toilet. That sucker needs double the flushes to get working right and was a huge mistake from the beginning. I had one at my last apartment and the on call handyman got tired of coming to fix it every other day. Eventually they swapped it out with a real toilet.
CMON MAN! Try harder! Theres plenty of real things to be angry about. If you've gotta make stuff up or focus on the stupid, piddly, unimportant things, you really arent looking at the world too closely.
You obviously are not eating enough!Jakeiscrazy wrote:In fairness your mostly right, but I don't have a problem with my low-flush toilet.
Hybrids for small cars are a poor idea. The weight added to the car from the car is a major problem as are the chemicals used for the batteries. If you think we are making a lot of toxic chemicals for our laptops and phones now, just wait until every car has them! The EPA standards are seriously flawed for hybrid MPG. Most owners of those 70MPG cars get significantly less, usually mid-high 40s. When they build a regular sized small car they usually get low to mid 40s. You can almost get that with a manual gas car and diesels in Europe easy eclipse that.ShortMan wrote:Yeah just so you know that was all utter complete bullshit.
The hybrid really does use much less gasoline and goes up and down hills just fine. And it IS an internal combustion engine, with a battery backup, so that 70% of potential energy which we've been wasting for over a hundred years can finally have some of it reclaimed. Thats why its called a hybrid and not an electric. Video maker should have criticized the nasty crap they need to make the batteries, which has no good argument at all.
If this is correct (http://www.eia.doe.gov/ask/electricity_ ... y_lighting) than only 15% of the average household power bill is due to lighting.ShortMan wrote:The fluorescent bulb uses even less than 25% of the energy of its incandescent bulb counterpart, which means fewer of your precious wetlands plowed over to make new power plants. And it comes on instantly nowadays, and the disposal method is no worse than what the other bulbs were required to have, but people just got used to ignoring those instructions. I'm sure they will do the same with these ones as well.
It depends on your CFL, but they are are much better than 25% more efficient on average. More like they only use 25% of the power of an incandescent bulb. I.e. your reference frame is flipped.Residential lighting consumption was about 208 billion kWh, equal to about 15% of all residential electricity consumption.
The lower usage is probably mostly due to model used to estimate the power. Using the worse number of 15%, saving 75% of your lighting power would reduce your power usage by about 11%. The average bill in the US appears to be $104.52 (http://www.eia.doe.gov/energyexplained/ ... _home#tab2), thus an 11% reduction would yield about $11.50 a month in savings. The really nice CFLs which are designed to have virtually no negatives concerning light spectrum, instant on, lumens, etc. cost nearly $5 a piece. Of course you can get them cheaper, but the quality of light is not comparable in most cases. The average users is either going to loose light quality or it will take 1-3 years to recoup the costs.For a given light output, CFL's use 20 to 33 percent of the power of equivalent incandescent lamps. Since lighting accounted for approximately 9% of household electricity usage in the United States in 2001, widespread use of CFL's could save as much as 7% of total US household usage.
That has to be one of the funniest things I have ever read.ShortMan wrote:And the main reason Obamacare is broke is because of what the conservatives did to it. But once again the guy making the video did not wanna acknowledge that.
It is possible, but not likely. I would require that they were using really inefficient versions like flood lights which give off a lot of heat. Also, really inefficient AC and insulation so that the power required to get rid of the heat from those inefficient bulbs is multiplied. Also couldn't hurt if they were the kind of people who leave all their lights on and/or are lacking windows (townhouse/condo?).Yarddawg wrote:When I was taking Electricity in school (many years ago BTW), we hooked up 40 incandescent lights (more than in a typical household) to a watt-hour meter supplied by what was then VEPCO, known today as Dominion Power. With all of the lights on, you could not see the meter move. Therefore, I highly doubt that changing all the lights in your house to CFL's cut your bill in half. There would have to be other things that you did as well in order to see that kind of savings.
With the cheaper ones that is especially true. Even the high end ones don't have great color or brightness when you first turn them on. There clearly is an increase in brightness and color quality.Yarddawg wrote:I have tried CFL's. I hate them! The color, being tempermental to start, etc.
LEDs likely won't ever offer the color quality you are looking for. Another issue with LEDs is that they don't take too kindly to voltage fluctuations. They take even longer to realize the savings not only because price, but because they aren't that much more efficient than CFLs. Typical "60-75W" CFLs are using only 10-20W. LEDs are using more like 3-7W for equivalent lighting (which only the really, really expensive ones do). Yes, saving another 5-10W a bulb is nice, but it is significantly less than the 50-75W+ saved with CFLs. I don't see them taking off until they can match CFLs in price which may or may not happen. Besides, LEDs are semiconductor devices which make even batteries look like green tech. Some of the chemicals used to make LEDs, solar panels, and ICs are the most toxic known to man. Some of the cleanest water in the world comes out of fabs because of that.Yarddawg wrote:LED's on the other hand, are a better alternative IMHO. Yes, they are pricey right now. With any new technology, at first it is expensive, then as it gains acceptance and the technology improves, the price comes down.
Agreed.gunderwood wrote:It is possible, but not likely. I would require that they were using really inefficient versions like flood lights which give off a lot of heat. Also, really inefficient AC and insulation so that the power required to get rid of the heat from those inefficient bulbs is multiplied. Also couldn't hurt if they were the kind of people who leave all their lights on and/or are lacking windows (townhouse/condo?).
Yes, you are correct that LED's are not exactly the "greenest" technology out there. Or are they? LED lights reportedly last 10 times longer than CFL's, create less heat (lowering your cooling costs), and no mercury.gunderwood wrote:LEDs likely won't ever offer the color quality you are looking for. Another issue with LEDs is that they don't take too kindly to voltage fluctuations. They take even longer to realize the savings not only because price, but because they aren't that much more efficient than CFLs. Typical "60-75W" CFLs are using only 10-20W. LEDs are using more like 3-7W for equivalent lighting (which only the really, really expensive ones do). Yes, saving another 5-10W a bulb is nice, but it is significantly less than the 50-75W+ saved with CFLs. I don't see them taking off until they can match CFLs in price which may or may not happen. Besides, LEDs are semiconductor devices which make even batteries look like green tech. Some of the chemicals used to make LEDs, solar panels, and ICs are the most toxic known to man. Some of the cleanest water in the world comes out of fabs because of that.
There are pros and cons either way and there is no perfect technology.Yarddawg wrote:Yes, you are correct that LED's are not exactly the "greenest" technology out there. Or are they? LED lights reportedly last 10 times longer than CFL's, create less heat (lowering your cooling costs), and no mercury.
http://www.greenzer.com/face-off_5
True. I know in my place that in the summer CFLs have made a huge difference. I get a lot of sun though so even in the winter my heat doesn't kick on much when the sun is out.WRW wrote:Cooling costs offset? The time of the year that the lights are used most is the time of year that the heat given off by lamps reduces heating costs.
Problem is, that time of year is when the sun is "out" the least. And you are absolutely correct about landscaping having a considerable impact on heating and cooling costs. Evergreens to the north and deciduous trees to the south and west.gunderwood wrote:True. I know in my place that in the summer CFLs have made a huge difference. I get a lot of sun though so even in the winter my heat doesn't kick on much when the sun is out.WRW wrote:Cooling costs offset? The time of the year that the lights are used most is the time of year that the heat given off by lamps reduces heating costs.
I over generalized, the previous owner (when we did our walk through) told me his last electric bill was $220(this being mid-december air conditioner usage was not a factor), I put in all CFLS (its a big house) and got a $120 bill.Yarddawg wrote:When I was taking Electricity in school (many years ago BTW), we hooked up 40 incandescent lights (more than in a typical household) to a watt-hour meter supplied by what was then VEPCO, known today as Dominion Power. With all of the lights on, you could not see the meter move. Therefore, I highly doubt that changing all the lights in your house to CFL's cut your bill in half. There would have to be other things that you did as well in order to see that kind of savings.
zephyp wrote:Green "whatever" = liberal claptrap...global warming = homer simpson science...