Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

The more I read/see the more firmly it becomes entrenched in my mind that if someone approaches me in an aggressive manner and they have a knife then they are going to get shot. No dithering, no wondering about "unequal force" or any other nonsense, they are either going to back off or get shot.

Deadly Stabbing

Deadly Stabbing in Waynesboro

Waynesboro Police and the Augusta County Sheriff's Office are searching for four men, in connection to a deadly stabbing on Sunday night.

One man was killed, according to Waynesboro Police, on the 200 block of Commerce Avenue.

Officers say, the victim was stabbed once in his chest. He ran to Delphine Avenue, where he was found, collapsed on the ground. Police say, the victim had "significant blood loss."

The man has not been identified. He's said to be 38 years old and believed to have lived where the stabbing occurred.

Waynesboro Police were notified of the man's death around 10:45 p.m. Sunday.

The four men who authorities are looking for, are described as Hispanic, driving an older model black Ford Taurus.

Police say they have a few leads they're following, including reports that "some of the subjects involved have ongoing gang affiliations..."

If you have any information, call the Waynesboro Police Department at (540) 942-6675 or the Augusta County Sheriff's Office at (540) 245-5333.

I don't care about the "gang" implications of this article, I only care about the fact that there was ONE stab...and the guy was dead. The though of being attacked by someone with a knife just give me the willies!

I'd rather be shot, personally... but this attack brings front-and-center the requisite we must all maintain - S.A.

Always know your surroundings, what and, more importantly, WHO is in it... and never let someone you do not know within your comfort/reaction zone.

A gun may not have saved this man's life if he was ignorant of his surroundings.

You are correct. If anyone comes towards me with a knife, stick, brick or even balled fist they are going to face retaliation. Period.

I don't know why you would even concider not shooting someone that came at you or a member of your family with a knife. As soon as the person crossed into my alert area (about 21 feet) with a knife in a manner that raised the hair on the back of my neck he or she would meet Mr. Walther and have one chance to drop the knife prior to extrem head and chest pain that Tylenol would not fix.
Bill

SgtBill wrote:have one chance to drop the knife prior to extreme head and chest pain that Tylenol would not fix.

In the words of one "Sideshow" Cecil Terwilliger "There may be a slight ringing in your ears. Fortunately, you'll be nowhere near them."

A knife can be a deadly weapon as can a baseball bat, car, or a hammer. If an attacker attempts to use any object that puts me or my family in a position where we fear for our lives, he'll get shot. PERIOD

A knife is actually more deadly in close combat than a gun. These gangs, espescially hispanic ones like MS13, use these types of random attacks and murders for their initiation rituals. These latinos are the most ruthless killers in this hemisphere, and they are everywhere now. While homeland security is strip searching little old ladies at nationwide airports these jackals are simply walking across the border in towns like brownsville texas, and , and nogales ariz.



...for those of you not already aware of the killers amoung us....

...Some 400 miles north of Charlotte, the northern Virginia and southern Maryland communities around Washington, D.C., have become MS-13 turf. Local authorities estimate that there are between 5,000 and 6,000 MS-13 members in the metropolitan area.

And where MS-13 goes, violence follows. In July 2003, an 18-year-old federal witness was stabbed to death; last May, a 16-year-old boy had his hands almost completely chopped off with a machete; and a week later a 17-year-old was shot and murdered. All three crimes were tied to MS-13 members.

The rapid increase in MS-13 activity along the corridor between Charlotte and D.C. is simply explained by Det. Tim Jolly, a gang specialist with the Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police Department. The area has the nation’s second highest population of Salvadoran immigrants.

Gang of Chameleons

One of the more unusual aspects of MS-13 when compared to other street gangs is that it is extremely flexible in its activity. While some gangs are only into drugs, MS-13 will do any crime at any time.

Sgt. George Norris, supervisor of the gang unit in the Prince George’s County (Md.) Police Department, says MS-13 doesn’t sling drugs in his jurisdiction. “We see mostly citizen robberies, auto theft, shootings and cuttings, and homicides,” he says, adding that drug sales by MS-13 may be just a matter of time.

Violent and Vicious

When MS-13 moves into a new community it tends to announce its presence with violence. The same can be true when a new leader takes over the local cliques.

Norris says gang members from other areas had once been able to join the new gang by simply being “jumped in.” But now that new leaders have moved into Prince George’s County and consolidated the cliques, the gang’s local culture has become more violent and vicious.

“According to one of our informers, things have changed,” says Norris. “Now in order to get your letters or clique [symbols] tattooed on you, you have to also put in some violent act to show your commitment.”

Cop Killers

And MS-13 violence is not restricted to civilians, rival gang members, and clique traitors; the gang will go after cops. Threats against police officers, known to gang members as “green light” notices, have increased so much in the past few years that the Virginia Gang Association has warned officers in Virginia and states to the north and south to be wary of MS-13 members.

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/ms-13.htm


.......moral of the story,.........shoot first, always shoot to kill .

GS78 wrote:
http://www.apfn.org/apfn/ms-13.htm


.......moral of the story,.........shoot first, always shoot to kill .

Well said...

It's a deadly weapon deserving of the appropriate response to same.

What's the old saw - the winner of a knife fight goes to the emergency room, the loser goes to the morgue? I don't care to get in a knife fight.

and, this is the very reason I carry a combat folder whenever I cannot carry a gun...

Funny thing about knife fights....

most knife fighters have no idea how to hold their knife for maximum effectiveness. There are 3 ways to hold a knife - 2 of which can be easily defeated / disarmed. The guy with the knife who comes at you the third way? Well, he knows what he is doing and you are going to get cut.

Expect in any knife fight that you are going to get cut.

ProShooter wrote:Funny thing about knife fights....

most knife fighters have no idea how to hold their knife for maximum effectiveness. There are 3 ways to hold a knife - 2 of which can be easily defeated / disarmed. The guy with the knife who comes at you the third way? Well, he knows what he is doing and you are going to get cut.

Expect in any knife fight that you are going to get cut.

No I do not expect to get cut in any knife fight. If I have a gun and he or she has a knife he or she will be shot multiple time's before I can be cut. This also go's for people with bat's, car's, etc.
Bill

SgtBill wrote:I don't know why you would even concider not shooting someone that came at you or a member of your family with a knife. As soon as the person crossed into my alert area (about 21 feet) with a knife in a manner that raised the hair on the back of my neck he or she would meet Mr. Walther and have one chance to drop the knife prior to extrem head and chest pain that Tylenol would not fix.
Bill

I love this! Seriously though, if I guy is coming after you with a knife you will have no doubts that your life is in danger. So IMHO, either brandishing your firearm could create space and cause attacker to leave
or you

If they have pulled a knife on me I will not let them leave. I won't live my life looking over my shoulder because I let some scumbag walk away that might want to plot a revenge etc. Nope, sorry they are DEAD.
Bill

SgtBill wrote:If they have pulled a knife on me I will not let them leave. I won't live my life looking over my shoulder because I let some scumbag walk away that might want to plot a revenge etc. Nope, sorry they are DEAD.
Bill

+1

Sgt Bill has it correct. For years police have been trained on the 21 feet rule. If a subject is armed with a knife and is within 21 feet of you, it will be almost impossible for you to draw your weapon from a holster, aim center mass and squeeze off two shots, before you are stabbed with the knife. I have witnessed this first hand in training exercises, where someone with a rubber knife was able to run up and stab me with the training knife before I was able to completely unholster and get on target by the time I realized the person was running at me with the knife to stab me. There is also a training video "Surviving Edged Weapons" that everyone should watch. It is also helpful to watch and learn if your placed in a sitaution where you need to judtify the shooting you just had against a knife attack.

Cheers,

Tim
9mmDerringer

SgtBill wrote:

ProShooter wrote:Funny thing about knife fights....

most knife fighters have no idea how to hold their knife for maximum effectiveness. There are 3 ways to hold a knife - 2 of which can be easily defeated / disarmed. The guy with the knife who comes at you the third way? Well, he knows what he is doing and you are going to get cut.

Expect in any knife fight that you are going to get cut.

No I do not expect to get cut in any knife fight. If I have a gun and he or she has a knife he or she will be shot multiple time's before I can be cut. This also go's for people with bat's, car's, etc.
Bill

Only if you already have your gun drawn. If he is holding his knife correctly (and most people do not), then you will be cut.

I'd like to practice a 21 foot drill with someone one day.

ProShooter wrote:If he is holding his knife correctly (and most people do not), then you will be cut.

So what is the correct hold?

Every time someone has attacked me with a knife (7 or 8 times because because I had a couple of brothers who were just as volatile as I) I simply did my Lone Ranger act and shot the knife out of the attacker's hand. When the attacker happens to be a stranger rather than a beloved relative, I follow the libtards' gentle advice and "shoot to wound." I then counsel the angry attacker on the benefits of talking out one's grievances rather than resorting to violence.

ProShooter wrote:

SgtBill wrote:

ProShooter wrote:Funny thing about knife fights....

most knife fighters have no idea how to hold their knife for maximum effectiveness. There are 3 ways to hold a knife - 2 of which can be easily defeated / disarmed. The guy with the knife who comes at you the third way? Well, he knows what he is doing and you are going to get cut.

Expect in any knife fight that you are going to get cut.

No I do not expect to get cut in any knife fight. If I have a gun and he or she has a knife he or she will be shot multiple time's before I can be cut. This also go's for people with bat's, car's, etc.
Bill

Only if you already have your gun drawn. If he is holding his knife correctly (and most people do not), then you will be cut.

You seem to think that I am one of your students, I am not. After 9 1/2 year's in the Military and 25 years in Law Enforcement I am aware of who and what is within my safety zone. If you talk to anyone who know's me you will find that I use a belt slide holster that has no retention strap and it holds every one of my weapons that I would carry to include my S & W Mod 686 - .357 Magnum, my Glock Mod. # 22 in 40 cal. or my Walther PK380 . On average I am more prepared then the average person that has a Con. Carry Permit and shoot better then most. So please do not try and tell me what you think I will have happen or not happen to me. Bear in mind you said a knife fight not a surprise attack from an asswipe with a knife.

Bill