Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

Some disheartening stuff from the liberal minded jackasses that currently represent 3 of Virginias congressional districts. HR 2324 submitted by Bobby Scott and supported by Moran and Connelly is another attempt to drum up sympathy for another (Close the Gun SHow Loophole) Bill. Seems these guys just don't seem to understand rights and privacy. If either of these brain dead politicains are in your district please contact them and tell them to knock it off.. We have grown tired of their BS. Following is from the latest VCDL update letter.

1. Congressman Bobby Scott going after gun shows
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I am ashamed that Virginia is represented by these three people. Virginia deserves better than this.

Anti-gun Virginia Congressmen working to destroy gun shows:

Rep Connolly, Gerald E. "Gerry" [VA-11]
Rep Moran, James P. [VA-8]
Rep Scott, Robert C. "Bobby" [VA-3]

You can send an email to your Congressperson by clicking here:

https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml

Be sure to tell them NOT to support H.R. 2324.

If you are a constituent of Bobby Scott, James Moran, or Gerald Connolly, be sure to let them know, politely, what you think of their working against America's gun owners.

Elections this November will provide an important opportunity to fix our misrepresentation in Congress.

http://tinyurl.com/25g77bo

bradycampaign.org
May 19, 2010

Washington, D.C. - The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence and the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence today expressed their appreciation to Congressman Bobby Scott (D-VA) for making a commitment to hold a hearing on legislation to close the gun shop loophole.

A bill requiring Brady background checks on all firearms purchases at gun shows was introduced last year by Representatives Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY) and Michael Castle (R-DE). Scott, who chairs the Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism and Homeland Security of the House Judiciary Committee, pledged to hold the hearing at a recent meeting with Lori Haas, whose daughter, Emily Haas, survived the April 2007 Virginia Tech shooting that left 32 dead.

"Our organizations look forward to working together with Congressman Scott and the rest of the committee as we move forward to pass this critical legislation," said Paul Helmke, President of the Brady Campaign.

"This hearing will show that gun shows are a venue where felons, domestic abusers and others prohibited from purchasing firearms can acquire guns with no background check and no questions asked. The passage of this legislation is long overdue" said Josh Horwitz, Executive Director of the Coalition.

Last week, 65 family members of fallen and wounded victims and nine gunshot survivors from the Virginia Tech University tragedy of 2007 sent a letter to Rep. Scott thanking him for making the commitment that as chair of the Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism and Homeland Security of the House Judiciary Committee he would hold hearings, stating that:

"We, the family members and the survivors of the tragedy at Virginia Tech are committed to closing the gun show loophole, one of the last remaining recommendations in the (Virginia) Governor's Panel Report... We especially would like to thank you for your commitment to hold House Judiciary Committee, Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism, and Homeland Security hearings on legislation to close the Gun Show Loophole."

Signers of the letter include the following gunshot victims from Virginia Tech Kristina Heegar Anderson, Katelyn Carney, Allison Cook, Colin Goddard, Lily Habtu, Emily Haas, Sean McQuade, Derek O'Dell and Kevin Sterne.

Im confused. Isnt the right for law abiding citizens to own firearms what we want? Im just fine with having to submit to a background check if it helps keep felons from owning guns. The more criminals who get their hands on firearms the more ammunition the left has to argue complete gun control. If we are to be the voice of reason we have to be reasonable.

Mike, I agree, however, the problem is that if we give anti gunners an inch they will want a foot and so on...where will it stop...it wont...they will press and press until we have no guns or the legal right to own them. There are already plenty of laws on the books supposedly to keep guns out of the hands of felons. I suggest they focus their attention AND OUR TAX DOLLARS on enforcing those laws and not creating new ones at the expense of our rights and money...

By the way, what gun show loophole? Is there one?

Understandable zephyp. I hate politics. I cant tell if your making a joke about the loophole or not but currently you dont have to submit to a background check to buy a handgun at a gun show unless you basically tell the vendor that you are a criminal.

The issue is there is no requirement for a BC between 2 private individuals...I bet if you buy a gun at a gun show from a licensed dealer you get a BC done...what this law would effectively do - if they close the non-existent loophole - is most likely shut down me or you legally selling a gun to anyone else unless we can do a BC and fat chance at that.

A lot of the transactions at guns shows are between "private individuals." I can get a table at a gun show and set up, make a sale no problem. No federal or state requirement currently exists that says I have to do a BC...whether I do it there or if we meet at a McDonalds and transact in the parking lot...hence there is no loophole...private transactions at guns shows without a BC is legal simply because private transactions between individuals arent regulated in any venue.

Now, having said all that I am not a proponent of selling a gun to someone merely because they have cash and I have a gun I'm trying to sell. We here at VGOF advocate the use of a bill of sale and exercising due diligence by asking certain questions and checking IDs...

I did not know that. I have either been misinformed or Florida gun laws prohibit private sales of handguns. I asked someone a long time ago and have been living with the impression the only way to sell a handgun was through an ffl. Good to know.

As long as you both are legal residents of VA and not felons or otherwise prohibited from possessing the firearm, you can do a face-to-face sale with no BC.

You can't buy across state lines. You can't do this at all in some states. You can buy a rifle across state lines as long as it is from a FFL. Can't for a handgun.

This isn't about BC or gun shows, this is about property rights. The anti-gunners have already interjected the government between lawful manufacturers, lawful dealers, and even lawful residents of another state. The only thing left is to interject government between personal sales. The question is:

Do you or do you not own the gun and can sell it as you choose without government being part of the process, so long as you don't violate any laws while doing so.

I say yes. The property (the gun) is mine and I should be able to sell it at will and also should be able to purchase one from another legal VA resident without seeking the government permission. That is all this is about. Nothing more.

The anti-gunners say "gun show" because most people who don't own guns have never been to one an the antis have successfully tarnished that word, just like the word militia. They use it to conjure up fear and emotion and imply something shady is going on when there isn't. Gun shows are a convenient place though because guess what, there are people looking to buy and sell guns there! If you wanted to sell a gun what better place to go? Forums like this are also great because there gun owners are here too!

All sarcasm aside, you should not have to get government approval to sell any private property...EVER.

After about a year the bill has 107 cosponsors. I don't think it's going anywhere.

mut617 wrote:I did not know that. I have either been misinformed or Florida gun laws prohibit private sales of handguns. I asked someone a long time ago and have been living with the impression the only way to sell a handgun was through an ffl. Good to know.

Not sure what FL state laws are but here in VA there are no restrictions regarding private sales...hence seller and buyer beware. We recommend you use a bill of sale and inspect valid VA ID, preferably DL and CHP if they have one. And, you need to have some idea of what the requirements are to purchase weapons like handguns. Just because VA doesnt restrict private sales doesnt mean you can ignore the basic law regarding purchase and ownership. Also ask the following questions and note that on the BOS:

Can you legally own this gun
Is this gun stolen
etc...

If they ever get allowed to BC private sales just watch what follows,Ammo, gun parts, and God knows what else , THe less goverment involvment in our private affairs the better,,, As it should always be. Our privacy rights are nothing to give up for anything or any reason.

zephyp wrote:

mut617 wrote:I did not know that. I have either been misinformed or Florida gun laws prohibit private sales of handguns. I asked someone a long time ago and have been living with the impression the only way to sell a handgun was through an ffl. Good to know.

Not sure what FL state laws are but here in VA there are no restrictions regarding private sales...hence seller and buyer beware. We recommend you use a bill of sale and inspect valid VA ID, preferably DL and CHP if they have one. And, you need to have some idea of what the requirements are to purchase weapons like handguns. Just because VA doesnt restrict private sales doesnt mean you can ignore the basic law regarding purchase and ownership. Also ask the following questions and note that on the BOS:

Can you legally own this gun
Is this gun stolen
etc...

I check ID for VA residency and DOB if they look close to 18. Also, I asked if they legally own the gun and/or can possess it. While others have required a bill of sale for me to buy from them and I don't have a problem filling it out, I have yet to require a bill of sale of anyone I have sold to. I know some people recommend them, but I wouldn't keep a BOS for anything else I sell. In a way, BOS are creating a de-facto, distributed gun registry. Just my 2cents.

gunderwood wrote:

zephyp wrote:

mut617 wrote:I did not know that. I have either been misinformed or Florida gun laws prohibit private sales of handguns. I asked someone a long time ago and have been living with the impression the only way to sell a handgun was through an ffl. Good to know.

Not sure what FL state laws are but here in VA there are no restrictions regarding private sales...hence seller and buyer beware. We recommend you use a bill of sale and inspect valid VA ID, preferably DL and CHP if they have one. And, you need to have some idea of what the requirements are to purchase weapons like handguns. Just because VA doesnt restrict private sales doesnt mean you can ignore the basic law regarding purchase and ownership. Also ask the following questions and note that on the BOS:

Can you legally own this gun
Is this gun stolen
etc...

I check ID for VA residency and DOB if they look close to 18. Also, I asked if they legally own the gun and/or can possess it. While others have required a bill of sale for me to buy from them and I don't have a problem filling it out, I have yet to require a bill of sale of anyone I have sold to. I know some people recommend them, but I wouldn't keep a BOS for anything else I sell. In a way, BOS are creating a de-facto, distributed gun registry. Just my 2cents.

IMO the BOS is more than just a good thing to have especially here in VA and most especially annotated with questions, answers, and yes even initials...too many bloomberg (the twit) stings...

It makes sense to be aware of the law when selling or buying privately ,but it is also overkill to demand a ton of information from either party,,If your going to do that just go to an FFL and be done with it. I look at private sales as more "don;t ask ,don;t tell". Its a private sale and as long as it's between 2 legal aged people the Fed or State have no business knowing what your doing. Overkill in private matters IMHO just gives the antis another bit of ammo to say ,"Look even gun owners support this or that stricter method" and emboldens them to try stunts like these 3 so called representatives are pushing..

VBshooter wrote:It makes sense to be aware of the law when selling or buying privately ,but it is also overkill to demand a ton of information from either party,,If your going to do that just go to an FFL and be done with it. I look at private sales as more "don;t ask ,don;t tell". Its a private sale and as long as it's between 2 legal aged people the Fed or State have no business knowing what your doing. Overkill in private matters IMHO just gives the antis another bit of ammo to say ,"Look even gun owners support this or that stricter method" and emboldens them to try stunts like these 3 so called representatives are pushing..

Best option is indeed to go to an FFL...most of what I said was a public service announcement for those watching but not talking...