Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

I think scenario discussions are great training tools. Here are three scenarios that I have been thinking about, I'm very new to CC, and would like to hear some opinions:

1. You are at the mall with your wife, (legally CC, in a mall that permits) looking at clothes in Eddie Bauer. You hear gunshots out in the mall from somewhere, and see people running. First thoughts are probably to insure the safety of your wife and yourself and those in the store with you. Then what? What good or bad things could result of action/inaction?

2. You are at the mall with your wife, (legally CC, in a mall that permits) eating at the food court and see someone with a weapon who begins to open fire. You knock over your table to provide concealment, and begin to analyze your options. What goes through your head? Get a line on the bad guy and return fire? Retreat? Again, what are the spectrum of options you are thining about?

3. You have just left your car in the Walmart parking lot and are walking into the store, (with CC weapon). You hear shouting and see three individuals appear to gang up on one. Punches are thrown and the one goes down and the three stand over him. Or the one turns out to be a female getting her purse stolen by a few thugs. Do you get involved?

Some of my general thought questions are:

- Does CC create "courage" that otherwise wouldn't be there?
- Would my actions be the same if I was not CC at the time?
- Per Top Gun, is it better to retreat, than to force a bad situation?

This is my first post, so go easy, but these scenarios and questions have been swirling thru my mind ever since I received my CHP.

Thank,

Fly Safe.

C40Pilot-

WELCOME to the VGOF!


you present some interesting senarios and i will weigh in with my thoughts as will others...we do that alot... & I really enjoy the discussion...

Please stop by the "new Memebers forum and introduce yourself...

BluemontGlock,

Hope to hear your thoughts. I'm the post in the new member intro area titled, "New Stafford Member", I just posted it a few days ago.

I'll chime in with some of my thoughts on the scenarios, with the understanding that my only carrying experience has been in the cockpit of airplanes.

1. This scenario really did play out just recently in Oklahoma, at a mall there. I think I would ensure my immediate safety, those around me, call 911, and barring any obvious immediate threats, stay put. This has to be a tough situation for a LEO to respond to and me wandering around will probably make matters more confusing. Even though I'm leagally CC'ing, I don't think I'd assume the role of sherriff.

2. Sitting in the food court watching someone open fire is different than #1. I'd probably take my immediate action of finding cover and/or concealment, and then think about engaging the shooter. Where he is, distance, threat to me/others, reality of making a clean shot. I'd try to not display my weapon to him until I felt certain he'd be on the business end of it.

3. I would definitely monitor the situation. Not every situation requires a weapon to be drawn, obviously. I wouldn't want my actions or words to escalate the situation. If the purse snatchers run away without harming anyone, that is probably the best outcome. If the thugs on the ground leave the one alone and walk off, again probably better than turning the three thugs onto me as their next punching bag. Defuse and retreat, right?

TM

Alrighty.

1. I'd never have a wife or go in to an Eddie Bauer, but okay. I'd be looking to escape and evade. I don't know the situation and am not stupid enough to go charging into the unknown with a little pistol.

2. Same as above, E&E. I'd only engage if I could not retreat.

3. No. I'm not a cop. Getting up in other people's business is none of mine. Besides, it may be a domestic - in which case it could become four on one.

C40Pilot wrote:
1. You are at the mall with your wife, (legally CC, in a mall that permits) looking at clothes in Eddie Bauer. You hear gunshots out in the mall from somewhere, and see people running. First thoughts are probably to insure the safety of your wife and yourself and those in the store with you. Then what? What good or bad things could result of action/inaction?

1.you find and kill the person shooting in the mall.

2. You are at the mall with your wife, (legally CC, in a mall that permits) eating at the food court and see someone with a weapon who begins to open fire. You knock over your table to provide concealment, and begin to analyze your options. What goes through your head? Get a line on the bad guy and return fire? Retreat? Again, what are the spectrum of options you are thining about?


2.look at all the gum and boogers on the underside of this damn table! then, you find and kill the shooter.


3. You have just left your car in the Walmart parking lot and are walking into the store, (with CC weapon). You hear shouting and see three individuals appear to gang up on one. Punches are thrown and the one goes down and the three stand over him. Or the one turns out to be a female getting her purse stolen by a few thugs. Do you get involved?


3.first you determine if the guy getting beaten up may be the "bad guy", if not, then you stop the beating by pistol whipping the biggest attacker until he is near coma stage.(the other two will run away)

Some of my general thought questions are:

- Does CC create "courage" that otherwise wouldn't be there?

(YES , much the same way beer gives some people bigger muscles)



- Would my actions be the same if I was not CC at the time?
(I can't say about you, but I am always looking for a fight especially at a mall, or walmart)



- Per Top Gun, is it better to retreat, than to force a bad situation?
(I don't remember Tom Cruise running away from a fight, or was it "goose" who retreated like a little girl?)

This is my first post, so go easy, but these scenarios and questions have been swirling thru my mind ever since I received my CHP.

(take a deep breath, stop watching so much TV or DVD's, seriously though mental training is ok, but confidence comes from training and experience. It has been my experience that training will automatically kick in when the need arises, and bullies and thugs run like little girls when confronted by "john Q. public"with or without a CC.)

Thank,

Fly Safe.

Thats all I have to say about that.(Forrest Gump.)

I AM my brother's keeper.

C40Pilot: be careful with GS78's input. He sees the world as one giant conspiracy out to get him...

tursiops wrote:C40Pilot: be careful with GS78's input. He sees the world as one giant conspiracy out to get him...

I believe you are qualified to make such an idiotic statement.

If you read the VA Gun Owners Guide they have a similar section at the end...for situations like you describe the author recommends you hunker down (not get involved) and call the cops...call the cops yes -- hunker down -- I dont think so...I'd be forced to do something...I dont carry a gun merely to protect myself and family...I carry a gun for other reasons too...if we cant protect others who are in imminent danger what the hell good are we...or the gun we carry...

Of course if you rescue someone be prepared for flack...it might be one of those women who would rather be raped than saved by redneck militia...

Our base obligation is to ourselves and to our family. Most people will advocate a retreat and so do I, but that depends on your tolerance on the suffering of others. Some people can safely rationalize the choice and tell themselves "I got out, my family is safe. Everything is okay." I myself cannot run away knowing I left a situation I could've stopped, that might haunt me more than the act of shooting a bad guy.

1. My first priority is to protect my wife. I'll get her outta dodge ASAP before I even consider my next move. If the shooting is still going on and the police have not responded, only at that point would I consider trying to stop the shooter but it's not tactically prudent to rush into the unknown.

2. Again, first priority is my wife, but this time I have the threat identified and located. I will do my best to direct my wife to safety, but the best way of ending this threat is to put him down. I will maneuver and take the shot when I get it.

3. This is tricky because it's not my business. If I was witnessing a fight or altercation I would call the police from a safe position (enough distance, maybe some cover in case they learn of my calling the cops) I would not personally intervene unless the person being assaulted called for help or the situation got very ugly.

- Does CC create "courage" that otherwise wouldn't be there?
For me yes. I am not a big & bad dude. My gun is my best form of defense and offers that feeling of security. Now courage does not mean arrogance or hotheadedness. Discretion is the better part of valor.

- Would my actions be the same if I was not CC at the time?
Yes. The choices to retreat or comply with demands become the only viable options when you're unarmed.

- Per Top Gun, is it better to retreat, than to force a bad situation?
9 times out of 10 I would say yes, but that answer varies from person to person. Discretion and valor again.

Now don't take my answers as advice. If I were YOU, I'd retreat. Get the wife outta there, make sure the family is safe, and hunker down. But I'm not so attached to this world that I would want to spend my days haunted by the thought that there were people dying and that there was something I could have done. This is something I've thought long and hard about. My 2 cents.

tursiops wrote:C40Pilot: be careful with GS78's input. He sees the world as one giant conspiracy out to get him...

Now that was funny! I guess you don't speak the language of Smart @ss!!

GS78 - Really, the world is out to get you? And here I was thinking they were out to get me!!