Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

Friends – I am posting this here as this seems to be the one gun related forum that is most respectful of its members, especially newbies. The following are simply my observations & ramblings on 2A support. I would appreciate your thoughts & feedback.

I consider myself very new to the world of shooting sports & firearm ownership. I did own two hand guns back before I was married (23+ years ago and still going strong) and introduced my bride to be to range firing. Let’s just say that after seeing her & a .357 I made it a point to just agree . . . on everything. However, over time, 2 kids + mortgage + car payment – her income = no cash for the range. Really, the math just wasn’t there. So, I sold off the two hand guns. Over time I came to own my Dad’s custom Ugartechia shotgun, a Soviet made SKS and my Grandpa’s “Monkey Ward’s” shot gun, but other than the sporadic trip to the trap range, nothing serious. Fast forward to September 2009 when a serendipity of events allowed me to get back into the world of serious gun ownership.

This was driven as much by desire (I love range time) as well as by necessity. I will not lie to you all and say it was because of Obama taking over. My feelings were much closer to home. Our once, very secure, little corner of Ashburn was rocked by a number of burglaries & home invasions and there is increased signs that gangs are trying to gain a foot hold. I refused to become a victim. Over the rest of 2009 I was solely focused on re-learning how to fire my Sig 226 and learning my new firearm – a StagArms Model 2 Carbine.

And here I stop to make a confession. I have never been that politically aware. I concentrated entirely on raising my two kids, assisting my aging parents and growing a business I practically helped start. I knew I did not like the Dems, could not totally agree with the ‘Pubs but I leaned more their way. Even after my initial purchase in September, 2A issues were something I did not pay attention to…yet.

Over the past couple of month I have signed up to a few gun related forums, joined the NRA and started to really pay attention to the 2A issues and am getting more & more involved. However, I have found there are two sides to defending our 2A rights; Activism & Life Style. Activism is (relatively) easy. Join the proper groups, make your voice heard and, above all else, participate.

The 2A lifestyle, on the other hand, can drive one batty. By “2A life style” I mean: Patronize those establishments that support your 2A rights and eschew those that do not. Well, that’s actually “2A Light.” I have come to understand that there is further extension of that which extends to paying attention to companies, organizations, people and even entire industries that either do not support the Second, or are actively against it. This is where life gets interesting.

Now, 2A light seems rather simple, does it not? If you walk up to the door and it has a “No Guns Allowed” sign on the front, you turn & walk away. If you OC into an establishment and are asked to leave, you do – permanently. OK, easy. Logically, any entity that is in the business of manufacturing, selling or promoting firearms is obviously a 2A supporter, right? Evidently, not right. My two local ranges’ owners support the Democratic Party? And Smith & Wesson are considered anti-2A?

As if that were not enough, “Total 2A” gets even worse. The main premise behind “Total 2A” (my term) is to keep your money out of anti-2A hands completely. OK, let’s run with that.

Got a kid? Do you take them to a Pediatrician? Well, congrats, according to some folks out there YOU are no longer a Patriot. Do you happen to practice the Jewish faith & tithe regularly? Patriot Card yanked! Member of the Boy Scouts? So sorry – the uniforms are made by the ILGWU (Look for the Union Label!). Own a copy of Saving Private Ryan – hand it over bub, you got double tapped (at least) on that (Tom Hanks and the Screen Actors’Guild). Do you have AFLAC Coverage? WHOA! Big mistake there! AFLAC Banks with Wachovia – an anti-2A establishment. Check your insurance portfolio – anything in there from GenAm? You a Kansas City Chiefs fan? Oh, too bad. Look at your Jeans label. Hey! Who wants a Slurpee? HA! No anti-2A slush for you!

And folks, I haven’t even scratched the surface here. In the normal course of getting out of bed, grooming, breakfast, driving to work & getting your morning cup of coffee, a body has probably funneled more than a few bucks into the anti’s pockets.

So, where do you draw the line? Can you draw the line? Do you simply accept the 2A Light style, grin and bear the other issues & try to counter the antis through activism and participation? Do research every single purchase & trip? Do you just say; “F it!” and hope for the best? As a 2A noob, I would really like to get this memberships’ thoughts on the subject. Perhaps I am over thinking it all. Perhaps I am not a Patriot. Perhaps I should just put on the asbestos jump suit now.

Sources:
http://www.vcdl.org/static/gue.html
http://www.nraila.org/Issues/FactSheets/Read.aspx?ID=15

Your not the first to come about later in life or even recently...Many including myself had been preoccupied with much more important matters at one time or another,, Activism IMHO is where it's at,, Participate and your voice is singing out loud and clear with others who feel the same way. On the life style I say remain true to YOU! If you want to do one thing or another, go somewhere ,or whatever else, do as You see fit for YOU. Don't worry about betraying some kind of trust that says you should do as it says or perish from God knows what. Practice what you want to practice and please yourself , Don;t worry about what is considered this or that,, We;re a free country for a reason... Use and enjoy it to your satisfaction~~

Howdy, Rich,

Your reasoning is thoughtful, but don't get too caught up in those "lifestyle" considerations. The single most important part of the 2A lifestyle or culture is to pass on your respect for guns and the Second Amendment to all those around you, especially your children. Nothing helps our cause more than a good example.

Regards,

George

Wachovia – an anti-2A establishment.

Wells Fargo now owns Wachovia and they are making strides, as they convert branches, towards honoring the laws of the states in which those branches are located.

wylde007 wrote:

Wachovia – an anti-2A establishment.

Wells Fargo now owns Wachovia and they are making strides, as they convert branches, towards honoring the laws of the states in which those branches are located.

And don't forget Starbucks out in Calif. They don't turn away those who OC inside their establishments. The Brady Bunch and the antis are fuming mad.

I bank at BB&T because anything else would be ridiculously inconvenient.

very well written , There is no way you can avoid all the anti business's, i checked out the list of gun unfrienly sites listed at the VCDL.org website, I will take my business elsewhere when i can. I practice a passive activism. Most of my workshirts are from the NRA(Rich need VGOF polo shirtss) and my hats are from different manafactures,NRA or my faviote Gary's guns and transfers. I slug to work and get a lot of questions and it give me he opurtuniity to spread information about the 2A in a non threating manner.

I asked the same question on another forum. I didn't get any takers on it.

Do what you can for the cause and move on. Some of the louder protesters to your question as you move forward are being overly critical and not looking in the mirror.

The VCDL is a great organization. Much more valuable to Virginia than the NRA IMHO. I'm a member of both and have recruited new members for both. The lists they provide are well and good, but there is only so much you can do.

Getting the word out to Independents and Blue Dogs, contacting our media and elected officials is key to 2A issues. Nobody can reasonably go through life without doing some type of business with the anti's. I believe anybody who thinks they are is being a bit naive.

Good advice, all - do what you can do, and spread the word responsibly.

Thank you all for the positive responses. I know I overthink things at times and have no qualms about asking for a sanity check (Insane? CHECK!).

So, my son is in NROTC and has his own personal armory (courtesy of Dad).

I took my daughter to the range once and she said that while she had fun, it would take some getting used to - then promptly asked if she gets her own firearm at age 18! I think she needs an outdoor range experience to lessen the shock of the loud BOOMs. If anyone has a nice outdoor spot, I'd love to know about it. If anyone has a 16 -18 YO daughter who shoots, I am certain my daughter would respond to that very well also!

Anyway - thank you all again and I look forward to a F2F meeting in the near future!

where are you located in virginia?

see pm...

Greybeard - I am in Ashburn, Loudoun County, VA.

Palladin - I did & thanks! I think she just needs a bit of coaxing.

check out the IZaak walton leauge in loudoon county, don't know if they ranges or not but the other 3 that i have been to had nice ranges.

Loudoun IWLA has a range with backstops at 100, 75, 50 and 25 yards. Also have a couple of pistol lanes wedged in the middle.

One trap range with high and low houses as well as archery. No shooting on Sundays unless you're in some type of class.

RE: daughter shooting

1) Try the Silver Eagle group off Waxpool Road and go in the early afternoon Monday-Wednesday.

2) Double up on hearing protection. Use earplugs and high quality electronic hearing protection. She will be able to hear your instructions while significantly decreasing the sound.

3) Attend Handgun 101 from FPF Training (fpftraining.com). The range is an hour away just outside Culpeper. It's an outdoor range so the noise will be greatly reduced. She'll get quality instruction in one day.

RE: Hardcore 2A Rights

It's not so much where the money goes, but rather the philosophy behind it. You really cannot control who's going to do what. Many times, you'll never know. Frankly, if private businesses are not contributing funds to anti-2A groups, the government gives them millions. Is this a valid reason to stop paying Federal income tax? I would say so, but good luck with that.

In the end, it's more important that you educate yourself and your children about Constitutional values. It's very important that they understand how the system really works (in a legal sense) and how the actual function differs from "TV reality". Check out originalintent.org (Education section) for good primers on these subjects. I suggest you tune into the Dave Champion Show (davechampionshow.com). I listen to his show because he cites the law, how it works and why it's like that. He also covers guns and all sorts of stuff. This week he's been covering how to interact with law enforcement while openly carrying a firearm (including "reasonable articulable suspicion", "probable cause", "reasonable" and related topics). Archives back to 2007 are available.

Again, thanks to all. Your presepectives & thoughts are all quite valuable.

wow, that was an impressive perspective on the different views. Since starting at SEG I've received many complaints regarding the owner's prior political donations. Its amazing how quick people are to stop utilizing a place based upon this, even though they opened up a shooting range. Tell me how anti-2A they really must be to drop all kinds of $$ into opening a state of the art shooting range that not only rents, but sells firearms to the public, as well as provides courses and instruction, including concealed carry.

230therapy wrote:RE: daughter shooting

1) Try the Silver Eagle group off Waxpool Road and go in the early afternoon Monday-Wednesday.

SEG offers some Ladies only courses, introductory and other, that might be beneficial to her.

MDukes wrote:wow, that was an impressive perspective on the different views. Since starting at SEG I've received many complaints regarding the owner's prior political donations.

Ka-POUNCE.......

"Prior..."? As in they've stopped? Please? Tell me it's so and I can shut the yabos up on ARFCOM.

KaosDad wrote:

MDukes wrote:wow, that was an impressive perspective on the different views. Since starting at SEG I've received many complaints regarding the owner's prior political donations.

Ka-POUNCE.......

"Prior..."? As in they've stopped? Please? Tell me it's so and I can shut the yabos up on ARFCOM.

Yeah. He was receiving requests from some of the local candidates, but isn't providing support to anyone to avoid more of the BS SEG keeps getting as a result. Sad really.