Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

It says my benefits will be about $2,714 per month at “full retirement” age. I think that means at age 70. Maybe it’s now 68. I won’t be 65 until early next year.

In 2017, I will have been paying into Social Security for 50 years.

Screwed much?

so, the least fiscally responsible organization in the country, our government, says that we are too stupid to manage our own retirement, so there gonna do it for us. Then, they say you can't have YOUR money until AFTER the age of the average global life expectancy. And if by some chance you manage to live long enough to collect, it won't be much or for long.

Any one who doesn't realize our goverment is stealing our money under the pretenses of being in our best interest is a fool.

Forgot to mention, for those who missed it, it's called social security tax. With Tax being the primary function. I bet you paid over $1m into the system, of which you will be lucky to see a fraction of on return.

It's a pyramid scheme. It was also the easiest form of wealth redistribution to pass, at the time.

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Lest anyone be misled, it didn't come as a surprise; it merely served to once again focus my attention on the vast theft that has been perpetrated upon me.

From where do you think the ghetto is taking the monthly checks, year after year? There's no tooth fairy.

kelu wrote:From where do you think the ghetto is taking the monthly checks, year after year? There's no tooth fairy.

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I already said I wasn't surprised. I guess I neglected to recite that neither was I deceived. They've spent the social security taxes as well as the entire balance of federal cash flow as they received it (buying votes) and borrowed $19 Trillions bedsides. We all know it. It's just that that damned statement rubbed my nose in it.

MarcSpaz wrote: I bet you paid over $1m into the system,

maybe, but most likely not even close.

doing the math in net present value, so we don't have CPI, or cost of borrowing debates.

118,500 - max taxable wage
7.65% - tax rate
9065.52 - max annual contribution
50 years
$453,276

Even if we ASSume, that the real 'cost' of the tax included both the employee and employer side of the tax, because lets face it, if your company didn't have to pay their side of the 7.65 they would pay it to you , then the total tax payed would have been just a hint over 900k.

Now unless paper routes, burger flipping, or grass cutting payed way better 50 years ago, than it did for me when I was a kid, there is no way he was making max income in the early years and therefore not paying max tax. And depending on your profession, you might never hit the 118k max wage.

so one of the interesting thing about life expectancy, is once you reach certain age thresholds, your chance of making it to an age well above the 'average' is quite a bit higher. i.e. if you made it to 65, the likelihood you have a genetic defect that is going to kill you at 30, is well, now zero.

If you hit 65, the average life expectancy is mid-80's. So lets assume he's average, and gets to draw his 2,714/month for 20 years. He can expect to draw $651,360 back out. Now you still have to pay tax on that, but lets assume a 20% federal tax rate. $521,088. Still almost 70k more than the max possible pay-in.

That's too much math for 4 A.M. LOL. I'll assume it's correct.

You take all the fun out of my rant when you you facts. No I know how libs feel. Hahaha

jdonovan wrote:

MarcSpaz wrote: I bet you paid over $1m into the system,

maybe, but most likely not even close.

doing the math in net present value, so we don't have CPI, or cost of borrowing debates.

118,500 - max taxable wage
7.65% - tax rate
9065.52 - max annual contribution
50 years
$453,276

Even if we ASSume, that the real 'cost' of the tax included both the employee and employer side of the tax, because lets face it, if your company didn't have to pay their side of the 7.65 they would pay it to you , then the total tax payed would have been just a hint over 900k.

Now unless paper routes, burger flipping, or grass cutting payed way better 50 years ago, than it did for me when I was a kid, there is no way he was making max income in the early years and therefore not paying max tax. And depending on your profession, you might never hit the 118k max wage.

so one of the interesting thing about life expectancy, is once you reach certain age thresholds, your chance of making it to an age well above the 'average' is quite a bit higher. i.e. if you made it to 65, the likelihood you have a genetic defect that is going to kill you at 30, is well, now zero.

If you hit 65, the average life expectancy is mid-80's. So lets assume he's average, and gets to draw his 2,714/month for 20 years. He can expect to draw $651,360 back out. Now you still have to pay tax on that, but lets assume a 20% federal tax rate. $521,088. Still almost 70k more than the max possible pay-in.

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I'm pretty certain $118,500 has not always been the maxtax wage (it started out much lower), and the actual tax rate, I think, has increased over the 50 years. So the actual contribution of both employer and employee will be significantly less than the $453,276 you calculated.

But I am a brand-new diabetic who is 100 pounds overweight and preparing to undergo treatment for prostate cancer while confined to a sedentary lifestyle due to a deteriorating spine. So that 20 years you assume might be a little optimistic in my case. But they aren't going to have the money to pay me anyway.

The Dow is currently greater than 200% of an adjusted 1965 value. The $70K figure is a one time interest rate of around 13%. Now, if the Govt. would start compounding interest...

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I get pretty disgusted when I get the SS notices. With the goal posts more than likely getting moved, I will have paid into the SS system over 50yrs if I make it to ever collect anything. I'm one of the sorry saps who's paid double most of his adult life too (self employed). 15.3% is what it costs me. Admittedly, I haven't paid the max contribution most of those years but, have paid the max contribution some years.

I would be content to just have back what I've paid into it, invest it myself, & roll the dice. I don't believe I'll ever collect what I've paid in.....

My life expectancy is 67. I'll never see a dime. I will max out this year before October ends. I have maxed out every year for the last 16 year... Working for 27 years... Self-employed for most of it. I'm just getting robbed, unwillingly participating in the largest unfunded pyramid scheme in our nation's history.

I'm still pretty far away from SSI, but if a) my body lasts that long, and b) there's any money left in the account (and all projections say "No"), then I'm investing it all in good mutual funds - hopefully, I can make my money back for all those years of being financially violated.

They CLAIM I can take it at "62"... and in truth? i'm considering it... Take a few hundred LESS to get MORE out of it in the long run.

Still doing the math, but at least i'm no longer on the "Redneck Retirement" program of working till I freakin' drop dead.

Reverenddel wrote:They CLAIM I can take it at "62"... and in truth? i'm considering it... Take a few hundred LESS to get MORE out of it in the long run.

Still doing the math, but at least i'm no longer on the "Redneck Retirement" program of working till I freakin' drop dead.

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My ole pappy signed up for social security when he reached 65 back in 1990; but he kept right on working. He was lucky enough not to need the money, but he said he worked for it, he paid it in, and he was damned well gonna draw it out.

When folks would ask him when he was gonna retire, his answer was always the same:

"WHEN THEY THROW DIRT IN MY FACE!"

That was pretty much the way it turned out, too.

I'll always "Work", but it won't be a Necessity! I'll work in a gun shop, or in a leathersmiths, or Lowes helping those ladies who need a hand.

Reverenddel wrote:I'll always "Work", but it won't be a Necessity! I'll work in a gun shop, or in a leathersmiths, or Lowes helping those ladies who need a hand.

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I think I'd go stark raving crazy without somewhere to go and something to do every day; except that long before I went over the edge of batsh!t crazy, SWMBO would probably cut my throat just to be shed of me.

I have a set of grandparents, both of them in their 90's, and they have retired several times over the past 3 decades. I don't believe that they have even made it a solid 48 hours into retirement, before finding more work to do.

I am thoroughly amazed that they are still living, more amazed that they still work, and somewhat terrified by the fact that they both still drive.

I have observed that retirement, more often than not, appears to be fatal.

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My 81 year old father does more with Izaak Walton and Trout Unlimited than I could imagine. It keeps him occupied and out of Mom's hair.