Gun owners registry

[kelu]

I had no doubt that this is happening.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-12-0 ... -report-it

[MarcSpaz]

Why does this not surprise me?

[AlanM]

Does the information sent in to do a NICS check have the information of what gun is being purchased and/or if, in fact, that a firearm WAS purchased?

What this:

“Between 2004 and 2014, suspected terrorists attempted to purchase guns from American dealers at least 2,233 times. And in 2,043 of those cases — 91 percent of the time — they succeeded.”

REALLY says is that 91 percent of suspected terrorists that submitted a 4473 to NICS passed the check.

Some fear monger is reading too much into that report. IMHO.

See: 4473.pdf
Question for a FFL holder here: Is the information in #18 transmitted to NICS when making a check. Also, after the sale, if there is one, is NICS or anyone else notified that the sale was consummated? Other than entry into the FFL's bound book and the retention of the 4473 that is.

[FiremanBob]

Yes, the info in #18 is transmitted. No, there is no record of consummation - but how many times do you think someone goes through the NICS process and doesn't follow through? Very close to zero. It is a reasonable inference that any check is actually a sale.

Alan, I'm not sure what point you are making. The point of the article is not that people on the (highly questionable) "terror list" are legally buying firearms. The point is that the government isn't supposed to be keeping NICS data but they obviously are keeping it in violation of federal law.

If you are a Democrat, laws are for "the little people" anyway. (And don't say - "But it was done under Bush, too" - most federal employees throughout the bureaucracies are Democrats.)

[MarcSpaz]

I have known about this for more than 8.5 years. It has been going on for a for at least 15 years, but I think it has been happening since 1993/1994 time frame. I found out about the agency information sharing through my work and I was shocked at the fact that once I knew the information for sure, that I didn't realize it before. I mean think about it. How long has the news been reporting the total number of firearms owners in America? That information was handed to the media from some government agency who is tracking it.

The reason they let people buy a guy if they make the list is because a significant number of people on the "Terrorist Watch List" and the "Violent Gang and Terrorist Organization" list have no idea they are on either list. The government doesn't want to tip their hand that an investigation my be on-going. Also, a suspect is just that. Technically, they have done nothing to justify denying them their rights.

Some anti-gun group on FB was spouting off about how the NRA is responsible for potential terrorist buying guns. They were saying that we let people on the "no-fly list" buy guns too, all because of the NRA. I posted this on FB in response to them...

The Terrorist Watch List and Violent Gang and Terrorist Organization File are integrated into a single database at the NCIC. If someone on that list got a gun AFTER going through a federal mandated NCIC background check, then there is a failure of existing laws not being enforced. Has nothing to do with the NRA.

After they posted some more stupidity about the National Counterterrorism Center, I replied again with this...

NCTC is a separate organization. The DHS and FBI do information sharing trough the Counter-terrorism Division of the FBI. It's actually called "Terrorist Watch & Warning Unit". The Terrorist Watch List and the Violent Gang and Terrorist Organization File are part of a larger criminal database called National Instant Criminal Background Check System, which is managed at the The National Crime Information Center. The NICS, hosting all of this info, is the same DB used to screen potential gun buyers.

[WRW]

Da Prez is saying that it is insane that people on the "no fly list" can buy guns. Why don't he just arrest them by Executive Order since due process has already been suspended for those individuals? Easy pest.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[Reverenddel]

it's coming to a head, people.

The Long Legged Liar in Chief is gonna declare "Martial Law" before the elections. I can sense it! If he doesn't? It's because he's a total (_____).

[MarcSpaz]

He needs to arrest a few white people for hate crimes against blacks or Muslims first... then it will happen.

He still has a year. Give it time.

[wittmeba]

Why does this not surprise me?

Me too.

The background check (form 4473) is kept at the local gun dealer 20 years on a purchase, 5 years on an inquiry if you don't complete a purchase.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/how-lon ... forms-4473

They know who has guns.

[Reverenddel]

You're naive if you don't think you're already on a list.

Between them cruising forums, recording the letters of protest, hacking sites/orgs for membership rolls.

Please! A 4473, and a NICS check is MINOR compared to the lists we're all already on.

[thekinetic]

Why does this not surprise me?

Me too.

The background check (form 4473) is kept at the local gun dealer 20 years on a purchase, 5 years on an inquiry if you don't complete a purchase.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/how-lon ... forms-4473

They know who has guns.

I don't know what you're talking about I have no guns, they all disappeared I didn't report it because I'm investigating their vanishing. So if the government wants to know about them they'll have to submit an inquiry form to me and i'll submit it to file and get back to them, this should take no less than five years and no more than twenty years. If after twenty years they are not found they can resubmit the inquiry form and I'll submit the new inquiry to file and get back to them.

[kelu]

The solution to this is already in progress. I was reading that since Obama is president, 100 million guns were sold. Maybe it's not true, but even if 50 millions are sold, it is creating more numbers in our side.

[MarcSpaz]

More likely its just the same people stocking up... I doubt we have even have that number that are new to the game.

[Reverenddel]

Getting them before they CAN'T! We've been through this in 1992/1993...

We're not stupid.
We're not believing ANYTHING, ANYONE, says...

We're spending it NOW, to have it LATER!

[SHMIV]

Oh, I don't know. I know that SOME of the folks are new, I just don't know how many. My step son, who is in his early 20's, is about to join the ranks of the armed. My mother has gone from being "nervous" about guns to deciding that she should have one. My father in law, who isn't particularly fond of guns in general and really doesn't care for handguns, recently told me that he'd feel more comfortable if he had a pistol close by. I've also had random conversations with other drivers at work, and at truckstops, that have recently reconsidered anti-gun views and concluded that they weren't anti-gun, anymore.

So, people are waking up; just hard to say how many.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[cwfunrider]

Oh, I don't know. I know that SOME of the folks are new, I just don't know how many. My step son, who is in his early 20's, is about to join the ranks of the armed. My mother has gone from being "nervous" about guns to deciding that she should have one. My father in law, who isn't particularly fond of guns in general and really doesn't care for handguns, recently told me that he'd feel more comfortable if he had a pistol close by. I've also had random conversations with other drivers at work, and at truckstops, that have recently reconsidered anti-gun views and concluded that they weren't anti-gun, anymore.

So, people are waking up; just hard to say how many.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Well let's just hope that come November they actually vote to keep that right. When ever I see a car or truck with both Obama and NRA bumper stickers I always ask myself WTF. Believe me me here in NOVA I see tons of vehicles with both bumper stickers.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

[2k05gt]

I know as an FFL03 (C&R) holder that the BATF can do inspections of my home and my records of purchases and sales of all C&R firearms, but I dont sell much, mostly purchase so I don't expect them to come knocking anytime soon.

[2k05gt]

Oh, I don't know. I know that SOME of the folks are new, I just don't know how many. My step son, who is in his early 20's, is about to join the ranks of the armed. My mother has gone from being "nervous" about guns to deciding that she should have one. My father in law, who isn't particularly fond of guns in general and really doesn't care for handguns, recently told me that he'd feel more comfortable if he had a pistol close by. I've also had random conversations with other drivers at work, and at truckstops, that have recently reconsidered anti-gun views and concluded that they weren't anti-gun, anymore.

So, people are waking up; just hard to say how many.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Well let's just hope that come November they actually vote to keep that right. When ever I see a car or truck with both Obama and NRA bumper stickers I always ask myself WTF. Believe me me here in NOVA I see tons of vehicles with both bumper stickers.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Doesn't the Owner of Blueridge Range in Chantilly have a Obama Sticker on his Car?

I know as an FFL03 (C&R) holder that the BATF can do inspections of my home and my records of purchases and sales of all C&R firearms, but I dont sell much, mostly purchase so I don't expect them to come knocking anytime soon.

[2k05gt]

Oh, I don't know. I know that SOME of the folks are new, I just don't know how many. My step son, who is in his early 20's, is about to join the ranks of the armed. My mother has gone from being "nervous" about guns to deciding that she should have one. My father in law, who isn't particularly fond of guns in general and really doesn't care for handguns, recently told me that he'd feel more comfortable if he had a pistol close by. I've also had random conversations with other drivers at work, and at truckstops, that have recently reconsidered anti-gun views and concluded that they weren't anti-gun, anymore.

So, people are waking up; just hard to say how many.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Well let's just hope that come November they actually vote to keep that right. When ever I see a car or truck with both Obama and NRA bumper stickers I always ask myself WTF. Believe me me here in NOVA I see tons of vehicles with both bumper stickers.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Doesn't the Owner of Blueridge Range in Chantilly have a Obama Sticker on his Car?

I know as an FFL03 (C&R) holder that the BATF can do inspections of my home and my records of purchases and sales of all C&R firearms, but I dont sell much, mostly purchase so I don't expect them to come knocking anytime soon.

[2k05gt]

Well let's just hope that come November they actually vote to keep that right. When ever I see a car or truck with both Obama and NRA bumper stickers I always ask myself WTF. Believe me me here in NOVA I see tons of vehicles with both bumper stickers.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Doesn't the Owner of Blueridge Range in Chantilly have a Obama Sticker on his Car?

I know as an FFL03 (C&R) holder that the BATF can do inspections of my home and my records of purchases and sales of all C&R firearms, but I dont sell much, mostly purchase so I don't expect them to come knocking anytime soon.