Idiots like this are why we will lose open carry rights

[scott9050]

http://abc11.com/news/man-with-assault- ... ll/825699/

What in the hell was he thinking?

[Snakester]

What an Idiot ! If he was there only to get his picture taken he should have had an appointment and dressed for the Pic at the Studio...This is why HOOTER GIRLS dress at Hooters and not where those little Orange Shorts in Public.

[Swampman]

http://abc11.com/news/man-with-assault- ... ll/825699/

What in the hell was he thinking?

He wasn't thinking. The ability to think critically, and to reason has been lost in this country. It is the fault of society at large, not just the schools, parents, etc., but the whole group. People assimilate information and react. Information is no longer processed. The fact that he complied with the LEO's proves my point. The guy has the capacity to think and reason, he just didn't exercise those abilities until he was faced with being shot.

[wittmeba]

July 4 weekend. Recent case at Naval Yard in DC. Very poor timing even if it were legal - which the Mall requested against.

Code of Conduct for Cross Creek Mall - Fayetteville, Va. (they ask of their patrons...)
http://www.crosscreekmall.com/code-of-conduct
20. Carrying or displaying weapons of any kind except those carried by certified law enforcement officers in the performance of their duties.

[Jeff82]

Unless he was walking around pointing it at people he should have been left alone. The sheeple are easily frightened. They need to get over it. They're the idiots.

[MarcSpaz]

Unless he was walking around pointing it at people he should have been left alone. The sheeple are easily frightened. They need to get over it. They're the idiots.

Jeff, I fully agree with you. You guys that are saying he's an idiot... I'm sorry, we've been friends for awhile, but its a crappy attitude to have. NC is an open carry state, just like VA. If I want to OC my M4 with a 30 round mag and one in the chamber ready to go and a couple of spare mags in a rifleman sub-load pouch, that is my right. If the cowards around me don't like it, tough. They need to get over it, because I have a God given natural right to defend my life how I see fit.

People are afraid of someone open carrying a weapon because of the Libs on the Left using the Media to scare the hell out of people. The only way people will get over that fear and learn that not every guy or girl with a gun is about to go on a shooting spree is if they have positive exposure.

This was a perfect chance for the LEO's to say "Sorry, outside of a trespassing citation if the property owner request one, we cant do anything because he's not doing anything wrong." Instead, they wrongfully arrested a man who was not breaking any firearms laws and committed no crime worthy of arrest.

[Jeff82]

Key part from Huntly:

"But although a gun is an “unusual weapon,” it is to be remembered that the carrying of a gun per se constitutes no offence. For any lawful purpose-either of business or amusement-the citizen is at perfect liberty to carry his gun. It is the wicked purpose-and the mischievous result-which essentially constitute the crime. He shall not carry about this or any other weapon of death to terrify and alarm, and in such manner as naturally will terrify and alarm, a peaceful people."

The charges should be dropped.

[arlington22201]

Were any laws actually broken???

[MarcSpaz]

Trespassing at best.

"Going armed to the terror of the public" is a case law offense. State v. Dawson, 272 N.C. 535, 541-42 (1968); State v. Huntly, 25 N.C. 418, 418 (1843); State v. Staten, 32 N.C. App. 495, 496-97 (1977) (citing Dawson).

A person guilty of this offense

(1) arms himself or herself with an unusual and dangerous weapon

(2) for the purpose of terrifying others and

(3) goes about on public highways

(4) in a manner to cause terror to the people.

Well, I would hardly call an AR-15 style weapon unusual, but all weapons are dangerous... so that seems really bogus.

The purpose was to get his picture taken... not to terrorize the people in the mall.

You can't legally travel to the studio to get your picture taken without using public roads.

I didn't think mere possession was grounds for the people to over react. Not brandishing, just carrying.

This case needs to get tossed out.

[scott9050]

Sorry, I have a completely different opinion on this. People taking AR15's to malls, grocery stores and other places were there might not be all 'rational' people at is what gets legislators together to decide "Maybe we should stop them from having firearms at all such establishments". It is also what makes companies ban firearms on their premises like different restaurants did with that open carry group in Texas. The mall already had clear no weapons signs, and if he were only wanting his picture taken he would have put the rifle in a case. And if only for a photo shoot, why the loaded magazines? I am as pro 2nd amendment as they come, but I am also about exhibiting a bit common sense.

[Swampman]

Marc is absolutely correct. The charges are bogus, and he cooperated with LEO's.

William is also correct. He should have known that in the current climate he would encounter some bed-wetters at a public place.

IMO he should fight this, and he should win. But I'm not holding my breath.

[MarcSpaz]

Let me run something by you real quick...

I have a bit more than $5k into my AR. I drive a Jeep Wrangler with a soft top and fabric doors.

What do I do if I am on a camping/hunting trip and need to drive into town to go to Wal-Mart to get some fresh supplies? I'm sure as hell not leaving my rifle in the Jeep. There is no way to secure it. I don't want it stolen and I think failure to maintain possession of my weapon and having it fall into the hands of a criminal will reflect in a worse light than having it slung over my back, barrel down while in Wally World. I may even get arrested if it is stolen due to leaving my suppressed SBR in the Jeep, resulting in it being stolen due to failure to properly secure my weapon.

And what about states like Maryland where the only legal open carry for personal defense is a rifle? They sure as hell ain't giving out CHP's. Should I be completely defenseless because I am in Maryland?

Truth is... my common sense and someone else's common sense when it comes to carrying a weapon is going to vary due to opinions. We have a legal system to protect everyone, and its based on fact. Not opinion or emotion. If its legal to carry my rifle in Wal-Mart or Macy's or my favorite restaurant, then damn it, if you're a coward and don't like it... leave... but sure as hell ain't grounds for me to be arrested.

Your rights are use it or lose it. If you don't use them... you have surrendered them. If we all take the attitude "don't scare the bleeding hearts", we might as well take the 2nd Amendment out of the Constitution now, because you are voluntarily surrendering your rights with that attitude.

There are ways to OC a rifle without being a dick about it. A mob, uninvited, coming to takeover a business with AR at the low-ready, to make a political point is not it... but a loaded rifle over your shoulder for defense is not and should not be a problem, you know, since its completely legal and all.

A positive experience is the only thing that will negate the negative Press.

[binabink]

Then there's this: http://weaponsman.com/?p=23798

[scott9050]

Let me run something by you real quick...

I have a bit more than $5k into my AR. I drive a Jeep Wrangler with a soft top and fabric doors.

What do I do if I am on a camping/hunting trip and need to drive into town to go to Wal-Mart to get some fresh supplies? I'm sure as hell not leaving my rifle in the Jeep. There is no way to secure it. I don't want it stolen and I think failure to maintain possession of my weapon and having it fall into the hands of a criminal will reflect in a worse light than having it slung over my back, barrel down while in Wally World. I may even get arrested if it is stolen due to leaving my suppressed SBR in the Jeep, resulting in it being stolen due to failure to properly secure my weapon.

If you have 5K for an AR, spend a little more and prepare for that possibility:

http://www.tuffyproducts.com/c-15-lockboxes.aspx

And what about states like Maryland where the only legal open carry for personal defense is a rifle? They sure as hell ain't giving out CHP's. Should I be completely defenseless because I am in Maryland?

Truth is... my common sense and someone else's common sense when it comes to carrying a weapon is going to vary due to opinions. We have a legal system to protect everyone, and its based on fact. Not opinion or emotion. If its legal to carry my rifle in Wal-Mart or Macy's or my favorite restaurant, then damn it, if you're a coward and don't like it... leave... but sure as hell ain't grounds for me to be arrested.

Your rights are use it or lose it. If you don't use them... you have surrendered them. If we all take the attitude "don't scare the bleeding hearts", we might as well take the 2nd Amendment out of the Constitution now, because you are voluntarily surrendering your rights with that attitude.

There are ways to OC a rifle without being a dick about it. A mob, uninvited, coming to takeover a business with AR at the low-ready, to make a political point is not it... but a loaded rifle over your shoulder for defense is not and should not be a problem, you know, since its completely legal and all.

A positive experience is the only thing that will negate the negative Press.

Look back at my response. Those with the 'It is my right, I can do whatever the hell I want and screw everyone else" are the ones who get those rights taken away. Because guess what, business owners have rights as well, they can and will ban open carry because of public backlash. And people with families, rational or not, may not feel safe with someone they do not know carrying an AR into a mall while wearing a tactical vest like he is going into battle. Or they guy who decided to go to the airport in Atlanta with his decked out AR15 and a drum magazine and causes articles like this one:

http://bearingarms.com/man-claims-harra ... t-airport/

When the NRA calls you out for the same reasons, you know you are on the far side of the issue:

http://www.thefederalistpapers.org/vide ... s-responds

[scott9050]

Then there's this: http://weaponsman.com/?p=23798

More than likely the charges will be dropped.

[Swampman]

Then there's this: http://weaponsman.com/?p=23798

Interesting to note in this piece that the firing pin had been removed, making it useless for it's intended purpose.

Marc I understand your point, use it or lose it. However, the situation he was walking in to would have dictated to me that caution should be exercised.

Point 1 - he was going to have photos taken for a movie casting call. Transport of his personal items (the AR and the vest) could have been done in a manner that wouldn't have drawn so much attention.

Point 2 - he removed the firing pin from the weapon, therefore is not carrying it for protection. He took a risk that I consider unacceptable. That being said, if some yay-hoo carrying a loaded fully functional firearm sees him and draws down, he risks being shot by some untrained idiot for no good reason. That untrained idiot could also have shot someone else. Also, why a loaded mag if the firing pin was removed?

Point 3 - If, as the author of the piece says, local LE hates military, why would he draw attention to himself?

Point 4 - you are correct, if we don't use it we lose it. We're losing it anyway, so maybe, as you say, that is more of a reason to use it.

I don't want to argue with you, but I would say that I would have done things differently were I in that situation. We Americans are being taught to report the unusual. A guy with an AR and plate vest in a mall is unusual.

People are wired differently than they used to be. They're stuck in their "reality-show" world of drama and they thrive on it. It makes them stupid. The media is also stuck in a "reality-show" world where facts are discarded as irrelevant. It makes them stupid as well. It's all about getting the most sensational story out as soon as possible. They use words like "alleged" to deflect criticism and legal action, even after a conviction.

This is an unfortunate situation that probably could have been avoided. Likely, because of an antiquated and outdated statute, this man will have his military career ruined by civilian and military prosecutors AND defense attorneys. I sincerely hope he beats this.

[MarcSpaz]

If you have 5K for an AR, spend a little more and prepare for that possibility:

http://www.tuffyproducts.com/c-15-lockboxes.aspx

I am actually. I love Tuffy Products. I am actually looking at this enclosure.

http://www.tuffyproducts.com/p-294-tuff ... osure.aspx

Better pictures here...

http://www.quadratec.com/products/14036_0003_07.htm

Look back at my response. Those with the 'It is my right, I can do whatever the hell I want and screw everyone else" are the ones who get those rights taken away. Because guess what, business owners have rights as well, they can and will ban open carry because of public backlash. And people with families, rational or not, may not feel safe with someone they do not know carrying an AR into a mall while wearing a tactical vest like he is going into battle. Or they guy who decided to go to the airport in Atlanta with his decked out AR15 and a drum magazine and causes articles like this one:

http://bearingarms.com/man-claims-harra ... t-airport/

When the NRA calls you out for the same reasons, you know you are on the far side of the issue:

http://www.thefederalistpapers.org/vide ... s-responds

Yes... those are extreme cases. I agree that people going extreme does more damage then good. I am just trying to stress that there needs to be a positive experience. And since we need positive experiences, let look at realistic events that could be good press instead of inventing situations that agitate the public. That's all.

I don't want to argue with you, but I would say that I would have done things differently were I in that situation. We Americans are being taught to report the unusual. A guy with an AR and plate vest in a mall is unusual.

I didn't think any of us are arguing. Just discussing two points of view on the same subject. If I came across as unfriendly or argumentative to you or anyone... I apologize. The internet has a way of making non-literary masters misrepresent emotion in text.

People are wired differently than they used to be. They're stuck in their "reality-show" world of drama and they thrive on it. It makes them stupid. The media is also stuck in a "reality-show" world where facts are discarded as irrelevant. It makes them stupid as well. It's all about getting the most sensational story out as soon as possible. They use words like "alleged" to deflect criticism and legal action, even after a conviction.

This is an unfortunate situation that probably could have been avoided. Likely, because of an antiquated and outdated statute, this man will have his military career ruined by civilian and military prosecutors AND defense attorneys. I sincerely hope he beats this.

That's for sure.

[Swampman]

Marc - you didn't come across that way. Don't want it to come to that. I do so enjoy the discussions we have here, and look forward to many more!

[MarcSpaz]

Good deal! I was worried for a second. I really love the conversions here. I don't want to spoil that for anyone.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[scott9050]

I didn't think any of us are arguing. Just discussing two points of view on the same subject. If I came across as unfriendly or argumentative to you or anyone... I apologize. The internet has a way of making non-literary masters misrepresent emotion in text.

No arguing, we are just discussing it. Personally if it had been me I would not have done business in a mall with a no gun sign. I tend to avoid these areas for obvious reasons. My favorite cigar shop has this front door:



The owners: