Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

Anyone catch Lou Dobbs and Bill O'Reilly tonight? Bill asked the question of civil unrest due to the falling middle class and rising poverty. Lou Dobbs said that it's near certain.

WOW... First time I've heard it on the factor instead of reading it on a gun forum...

Wait till Bamacare starts digging REAL deep into poor working people's pocket, it will get worse... and you wont even have a choice...

JC

Needs to fall faster. At the slow pace so far, its not enough to piss anyone off.

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I'd rather see the good, but silent Americans (still the majority overall) get active in elections and lobbying efforts to peaceably drive the "Progressive" fascists from power forever. It is still possible.

Remek wrote:Needs to fall faster. At the slow pace so far, its not enough to piss anyone off.

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Patience young Jedi, patience.

It's already falling, it will pick up speed as it approaches terminal velocity.

It will be interesting to see what happens when it finally makes contact with the ground.

The funny thing?

No names because they requested, but a co-workers church friend was put into a mental institution because the doctor asked per the ACA (OBAMACARE) "Do you own any firearms?" and they replied "None of your damned business."

Within two days? Arrest by Louisa Deputies, and put in a 72 hour hold, and because they refused to co-operate... 30 day extension...

You want unrest? You should see what kinda unrest is coming....

Mao Tse Tung once said "Better to blend into the background, than stand in front, and be target."

We fuss on this website TOO much. We're already on lists... but ... we're Americans, some are blessed as Southerners... and we don't cotton to a guv'mint that tells us what to do.

So Rev, someone was detained for refusing to answer questions regarding firearms?

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When and in what part of the county did this happen? How is it known the two events were related rather than just odd coincidence? (Didn't think a medical "interview" held the weight of law or required compulsory answers - do we need our lawyer on speed dial when we get a checkup?)

Whoa.....ok...now that is bad. This needs to be investigated now. How does a medical interview cause this. If a MD has this sort of power we got more problems than I thought.

So I guess the thing is, when you're asked that question by your doc, either
(1) LIE; Hell-fahr, you do that when he asks about other stuff you don't want to tell him, or
(2) Smile sweetly, adopt the voice of HAL 9000 and say "I'm not here to talk about guns, I'm here for a checkup. What do you want to know about my health?
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Unless this guy was so hateful when he told them it was none of their damned business (which it certainly WASN'T) that they made him out to be violent or irrational, I can't see how the guy wound up detained. Someone (usually a doctor or family member) must have sworn out an affidavit that the guy was dangerous to himself or others. I think the proper term is a Temporary Detention Order. Then they get taken to an evaluation Center (the nearest to here is/was in Lebanon, which is 40 miles) for evaluation. Even then, I've seen this done for people who were Oxycodone addicts, and they got back to town before the deputies that took them the evaluation center did. That’s because the addicts quickly learn the right answers to the evaluator’s questions and game the system. I’d say if you continued to be pissed off, uncooperative and confrontational, the evaluator would tend to punish you for not helping her sing cum-bye-yah around the campfire.

I would love to hear more about this case and also love to see it go mainstream in the media.

I like option 1.

It is none of their beeswax, but MD's seem to think everything is their beeswax. You did not take an oath of honesty so I have no moral problem with telling them what they need to hear. I do that with my tetanus vaccination everytime, anyway as they threw a fit everytime I told them that my family has nasty reactions (ranging from moderate swelling to seizures), so now I just say I believe I am up to date. What a sad state of affairs we are at.

>> Unless this guy was so hateful when he told them it was none of their damned business (which it certainly WASN'T) that they made him out to be violent or irrational, I can't see how the guy wound up detained. Someone (usually a doctor or family member) must have sworn out an affidavit that the guy was dangerous to himself or others.

Dorm... since when is being a jerk, rude, or otherwise verbally hostile to someone grounds for involuntary incarceration? If this were the case, wouldn't the statists be locked up for comments like "execute all nra members", etc. which is, imo, an actual incitement to threaten people's well being?

GeneFrenkle wrote:>> Unless this guy was so hateful when he told them it was none of their damned business (which it certainly WASN'T) that they made him out to be violent or irrational, I can't see how the guy wound up detained. Someone (usually a doctor or family member) must have sworn out an affidavit that the guy was dangerous to himself or others.

Dorm... since when is being a jerk, rude, or otherwise verbally hostile to someone grounds for involuntary incarceration? If this were the case, wouldn't the statists be locked up for comments like "execute all nra members", etc. which is, imo, an actual incitement to threaten people's well being?

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I wasn't trying to justify what happened (if indeed it did happen). I agree with YOU, OK?

By way of offering a possible explanation as to how such a thing could happen, I was remarking that there is a procedure (the TDO) by which someone (usually a doctor or family member) can sign an affidavit that a person is exhibiting behavior that reasonably leads one to believe they are a danger to themselves or others. If the Magistrate (it may require a judge, - I don't remember) is persuaded of the efficacy of the concern, a TDO issues and the subject of the order gets hauled off for an evaluation; after which they are either released or committed for treatment. I was speculating that perhaps the guy was so mean and nasty someone decided he was dangerously violent (or decided to teach him a lesson by having him evaluated for same). There is, after all, a VERY thin line between anti-gun hysteria and malice.

Now, to put the shoe on the other foot for a minute, what about the Colorado theater shooter or the Navy Yard shooter? If such an order had issued against them, might the tragedies have been avoided? Don't know/maybe/probably not? But at any rate, that's the thinking. The TDO I suspect is most used in cases of substance abuse where an abuser seems near to finally fatally overdosing.

And of course any procedure can be (and inevitably will be) abused. That's one reason why we all distrust government. It runs on procedure; sometimes to the exclusion of facts, logic and common sense.

Lol I was being rhetorical and trying to point out the very slippery (and as you pointed out abusable) slope. I'm just having a tough time reconciling a Louisa Judge signing the order based upon an accusation of "the dude was a meanie and told me to mind my business" and having the involuntary commital extended because the dude was upset at being held to begin with (whew! my hs english teacher would have swatted my knuckes seeing that sentence!) Living in Orange, it just strikes me as, well, wierd and unexpected.

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Damn, Rev never came back. must have gotten picked up by a black van for talking about it lol.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

The problem is that the current administration does want doctors to be able to collect this information. As we know its not a medical issue until someone gets shot. However, they've been trying to force this nonsensical logic for a long time now.

Personally, I lie my ass off. F-them. They don't know need to know about by red ryder BB gun!

GeneFrenkle wrote:Lol I was being rhetorical and trying to point out the very slippery (and as you pointed out abusable) slope. I'm just having a tough time reconciling a Louisa Judge signing the order based upon an accusation of "the dude was a meanie and told me to mind my business" and having the involuntary commital extended because the dude was upset at being held to begin with (whew! my hs english teacher would have swatted my knuckes seeing that sentence!) Living in Orange, it just strikes me as, well, wierd and unexpected.

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Well, unless the dude really did exhibit dangerous tendencies, he ought to be seriously considering suing the doctor, IMO.

Remek wrote:The problem is that the current administration does want doctors to be able to collect this information. As we know its not a medical issue until someone gets shot. However, they've been trying to force this nonsensical logic for a long time now.

Personally, I lie my ass off. F-them. They don't know need to know about by red ryder BB gun!

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Next question: How long is it going to take for the feds to take the position that you knew this information was going into the ACA's computerized medical database and so you willfully falsified federal records?

dorminWS wrote:

Remek wrote:The problem is that the current administration does want doctors to be able to collect this information. As we know its not a medical issue until someone gets shot. However, they've been trying to force this nonsensical logic for a long time now.

Personally, I lie my ass off. F-them. They don't know need to know about by red ryder BB gun!

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Next question: How long is it going to take for the feds to take the position that you knew this information was going into the ACA's computerized medical database and so you willfully falsified federal records?

If you've thought it, they have thought of it.

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