Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

A Department of Defense teaching guide meant to fight extremism advises students that rather than “dressing in sheets” modern-day radicals “will talk of individual liberties, states’ rights, and how to make the world a better place,” and describes 18th-century American patriots seeking freedom from the British as belonging to “extremist ideologies.”

The guide comes from documents obtained by Judicial Watch and is authored by the Defense Equal Opportunity Management Institute, a DoD-funded diversity training center.

Under a section titled “extremist ideologies,” the document states, “In U.S. history, there are many examples of extremist ideologies and movements. The colonists who sought to free themselves from British rule and the Confederate states who sought to secede from the Northern states are just two examples.”

Besides a brief reference to 9/11 and another to the Sudanese civil war, the guide makes no mention of Islamic extremism.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2013/08/23/defen ... z2cq4cFEMY

Well I tell you what: I agree.

Extremism is not always a bad thing because sometimes extreme measures are what is needed. They took their views to the point of revolution. It's was extreme but it was for the betterment of the country. The idea of a free republic like they set up was very extreme for the time and so far from anything any of them had know in their lifetime. Just because your extreme doesn't make you wrong.

Jakeiscrazy wrote:Just because your extreme doesn't make you wrong.

Your government doesn't agree with you.

allingeneral wrote:

Jakeiscrazy wrote:Just because your extreme doesn't make you wrong.

Your government doesn't agree with you.

To borrow from Virginia's state flag: SIC SEMPER TYRANNIS.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 4

I'm with you, Jake.

Although, I will point out that our Founding Fathers did not WANT a revolution. They tried less violent methods, first. The revolution came about as a last resort. Had the king been more agreeable, we'd likely be British subjects, today.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

The King's insanity probably didn't help much.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

I told you all the military was being conditioned to clamp down hard on US citizens when they're told to do so.

And it's never a good thing to face an organized mob...

Good luck Guv'mint!

I wonder. Did it occur to the folks that wrote that teaching guide to include the pre-civil war abolitionists and the anti-Vietnam War demonstrators as "extremists"? What about that feller that keeps advocating "fundamentally changing America"?

To state the obvious...

Extreme times call for extreme measures.

@Kreutz : I never disagreed with you. I was hoping that most of our enlisted would have the fortitude to resist such teaching, but post-bombing occurrences up in Massachusetts has left me doubtful. Which sucks, of course.

@Dormin: Of course not; they wrote it. (Well, maybe not the abolitionists) They wouldn't want to put that label on themselves.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

SHMIV wrote:@Kreutz : I never disagreed with you. I was hoping that most of our enlisted would have the fortitude to resist such teaching, but post-bombing occurrences up in Massachusetts has left me doubtful. Which sucks, of course.

Who doesn't want to play a real life FPS where the targets are dehumanized extremist separatist racist gun nuts?

Hell, the drone "pilots" have been playing war as video game for years, why not let the rest get a turn?

Mark my words you are seeing the slow and sure transformation of citizens who otherwise consider themselves patriots into "them" by the military.

And no one really thinks twice before shooting "them" after all.

It's not like they're "us" or anything right?

Kreutz wrote:I told you all the military was being conditioned to clamp down hard on US citizens when they're told to do so.

When did this start? I just retired in 2010 and I still work alongside active duty today. What does this indoctrination look like so I can spot it?


Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

arab1302 wrote:

Kreutz wrote:I told you all the military was being conditioned to clamp down hard on US citizens when they're told to do so.

When did this start? I just retired in 2010 and I still work alongside active duty today. What does this indoctrination look like so I can spot it?


Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I'd say if it is well enough done, you can't spot it; and that's the whole point of indoctrination. It is one thing to ORDER someone to do something. It is quite another to render them WILLING to do it.

Seems to me it would be a matter of slowly building a mindset by shaping the information at the subjects disposal and exposing them to the attitudes you want them to adapt so as to impress than upon them as a norm. Our mainstream media has been doing it for decades. I was wondering this weekend about the sudden flurry of shows on reality TV about dumbassed, ignorant rednecks: Porter Ridge, The one about moonshiners, and there is even a new one starring "Big Tom" of Survivor fame from Rich Valley, VA. I guess they're putting what must look like serious money in their pockets by making themselves available for these wild parodies of their culture and lifestyle, but they are surely assisting the media in "dehumanizing" rural americans and convincing that vast majority that get most of their information from TV that anybody with an Appalachian or other "redneck" accent is so ignorant and dimwitted they are only marginally human. Makes me wonder if "city boys" might feel like if they pulled the trigger on old bubba they would just be putting the poor sod out of his misery. P!sses me off monumentally.

Well, if one were critical about what's happened to law enforcement over the last few decades, consider how they seemingly have changed.

- Social pressure created to promote arrests/tickets counts as measures of effectiveness and merit
- Stratification between "LEO" and "Civilians" (LEO aren't civilians anymore and are "different" somehow)
- All Non-LEO are lawbreakers mindset, it's just a matter of catching them
- Greater deltas in force differential ("raid" on a animal center for a young deer, shooting dogs that are not an immediate physical threat)
- Greater (perceived) acceptance of sloppy or illegal acts (raiding wrong house, actions based upon unsigned/incorrect/nonexistent warrants)
- Training on what constitutes (un)lawful activity(think about OC issues in various jurisdictions)
etc.

Probably for what Kreutz/dormin are suggesting, it's probably more at the stratification and separation point without the reinforcement that the military is subservient to elected civilian leadership (we're military; they're civilian pukes). When I was supporting the USMC as a contractor puke, never really saw anything like that on the non-FMF side (worst were folks right out of TBS with huge chips on their shoulders). Don't know about FMF.

Anyway, just some thoughts...

Here is some information for you to consider:

I think the numbers in combination with the idea that most Soldiers would not attack their own home would present a monumental challenge to any idea of using troops in a massive police action. Looking at the demographics, the south and flyover country is the area that most service members come from, not the liberal bastions of the left coast and north east.

GeneFrankle brought up some points that I would look at through a slightly different prism. I don't think that the LEO community is more radicalized than in the past. I believe it is more closely watched than in the past. Their transgressions don't get a free pass as easily. The deer case he mentioned has gotten national attention, something that would have been unheard of 20 years ago. Look at the case involving the Culpeper officer, he eventually was convicted, maybe not of everything some folks thought he should have been convicted of. Then there is the case of the UVA girls and the ABC agents, I am hoping the judge lets the officers involved know that pulling a firearm on person suspected of underage purchase of alcohol is excessive. The bottom line is, you have to look at the numbers, just like gun control.

grumpyMSG wrote:I think the numbers in combination with the idea that most Soldiers would not attack their own home would present a monumental challenge to any idea of using troops in a massive police action. Looking at the demographics, the south and flyover country is the area that most service members come from, not the liberal bastions of the left coast and north east.

The Chinese had a very simple solution to that when it came time to squish those people in Tiananmen Square; just bring in troops that weren't from Beijing.

The rest is history.

arab1302 wrote:

Kreutz wrote:I told you all the military was being conditioned to clamp down hard on US citizens when they're told to do so.

When did this start? I just retired in 2010 and I still work alongside active duty today. What does this indoctrination look like so I can spot it?


Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

Looks kinda like this and the OP actually:

http://hotair.com/archives/2013/04/08/a ... st-groups/

A slideshow presentation shown to US Army Reserve recruits classifies Christians, including both evangelicals and Roman Catholics, as religious extremists, placing them in the same category as skinheads, the Ku Klux Klan, Hamas and Al Qaeda.

The presentation also warned that members of the military are prohibited from taking leadership roles in any organization the Pentagon considers ‘extremist,’ and from distributing the organization’s literature, whether on or off a military installation.

@grumpy - that may have merit, too. Another thing to consider is the volume being reported by the news, information availability via the internet, and the elimination of the fairness doctrine in '87. What really kinda raises my eyebrow is how the role of SWAT has changed over time. In my understanding, that capability used to be used only in hostage situations. Nowadays it seems to be used for other things (sledgehammer on a fly deal?). Heck, even Orange county has a SWAT team. On the way to the dump, you can see it parked right outside the Sheriff's office.

Founding fathers were extremist, you all make that sound like a bad thing. to quote Thomas Jefferson "When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government fears the people, there is liberty "