Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

Here is an article suggesting that the 9mm is gaining traction as a replacement for the .40 S&W here in the USA. Interesting read.

http://pistol-training.com/archives/8382

Paging Mr. Cooper.....Would Mr. Cooper please come to the concierge desk.....

Now, decades of experience have proven that no common law enforcement handgun round, whether it’s 9mm, .40, 357, or .45 rises to the mythical “one shot stop” level. With current technology, the hollowpoints being designed and manufactured by the major ammunition companies are all comparable to one another regardless of caliber.

QFT

There are slight differences in failure modes, but overall shoot what works for you.

Yet another article in the same vein, this one titled 'The Fading 40.'

http://www.thebangswitch.com/the-fading-40/

That's right; everyone shoot 9mm. More 40 on the shelf for me!

The articles make some good points, but I'll state it up front. There is nothing wrong with .40 either. It's not my preferred choice though.

9mm got a bad rap because of the timing in with which LEA's switched over; namely the marketing of "magic" bullets and using one HP design across a range of bullet weights which caused failures. Fast and light tended to fragment to easily and didn't penetrate to vitals. Slow and heavy didn't expand consistently. Generally, all of that is fixed with modern HP designs, so it's no surprise that people are starting to migrate back to 9mm due to cost and recoil.

The one thing that .357SIG/.40SW can do that 9mm really can't is be loaded well into the 500+ ft-lb range and near 600. Not that energy is the end all. What really matters is how you use that energy, but if you can control it, doesn't hurt to have a bit more to work with. The problem is that so few manufacturers actually load the cartridges to their peak performance like they often do with 9mm.

It's really silly if you think about it; marketing at it's finest.

(shrugs) So will people stop giving me crap because I like the .45 ACP? No.

I like 9mm as well.

.40 just appeared to be the "best of both worlds", but not being a standard in any military for any country. I skipped it because I like surplus ammo.

what about 10mm?

I've always liked 9mm pistols for CC and I have no plans of switching calibers any time soon.

GeneFrenkle wrote:what about 10mm?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Always wondered why .40cal took off like a wild indian goin ' to sh!t, and 10mm never caught on much. No personal experience with a 10mm. But after all, 10mm = .3937 inches (or caliber); so there was little difference in the slug diameter. Don't know about the load. I figure the tale about the .40cal-for-9mm swap-out deal to beat the new mag limitations makes more sense than anything I ever heard. Some sharp pistol peddler figured out how to sell a crap-load of .40cal pistols, get the government to pay for most of it with law-enforcement grants, and sell the trade-ins at scalper's prices. Pretty slick. Guy must have been the gun salesman of the century before Obama came along.

dorminWS wrote:

GeneFrenkle wrote:what about 10mm?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Always wondered why .40cal took off like a wild indian goin ' to sh!t, and 10mm never caught on much. No personal experience with a 10mm. But after all, 10mm = .3937 inches (or caliber); so there was little difference in the slug diameter. Don't know about the load. I figure the tale about the .40cal-for-9mm swap-out deal to beat the new mag limitations makes more sense than anything I ever heard. Some sharp pistol peddler figured out how to sell a crap-load of .40cal pistols, get the government to pay for most of it with law-enforcement grants, and sell the trade-ins at scalper's prices. Pretty slick. Guy must have been the gun salesman of the century before Obama came along.

.40SW is 10mm Auto, but shorter...hence .40 Slow & Weak. Most 10mm on the market is downloaded quite a bit. 10mm is basically .41Mag performance (when using the short barrels we commonly find in SD firearms, not the longer hunting revolvers).

Although it was selected by the Federal Bureau of Investigation in 1989 for field use from the aftermath of the 1986 F.B.I. Miami Shootout, the cartridge was phased out after their Firearms Training Unit eventually "concluded that its recoil was excessive in terms of training for average agent/police officer competency of use and qualification",[6] and that the pistols that chambered it were too large for some small-handed individuals. These issues led to the creation and following adoption of a shorter version of the 10mm that exists today as the .40 Smith & Wesson. The 10mm never attained the mainstream success of this compact variant, but there is still an enthusiastic group of supporters who often refer to the .40 S&W as the ".40 Short & Weak".[7]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10mm_Auto

The average shooter just doesn't train enough to effectively use 10mm. Remember, it's a balance of power, speed, and accuracy that ultimately wins a gunfight. 500SW might be incredibly powerful, but the guy with 9mm is already on his first reload with 5+ hits before you can even get it on target. Full power 10mm is 650-750ft-lbs, while most SD calibers are 400-500ft-lbs. That's a good deal more recoil. However, most factory 10mm is downloaded to ~500-550ft-lbs, which is a crying shame.

Don't call it a comeback, I've been here for YEARS!
-L.L. Cool J