Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

Yeah that pellet gun stuff was sure impressive!

One thing I'll add about pellet guns... I had a sale to a guy in NJ the other day and I couldn't ship a pellet gun to him without sending it through an FFL to transfer it to his possession. How ridiculous is that?

Very, But then again it's New Jersey,a place that sucks!

zephyp wrote:Ok, so the same thing then...currently an HB that would grant civil immunity and protection provided no charges or acquittal. VCDL only supports that while strongly supporting letting me shoot a pellet gun in my backyard...whats up with that? Is civil immunity and protection "guaranteed" by common and/or case law and if so can we rest assured based on promises, suppositions, and anecdotal statistics that civil prosecutions are rarely won?

I saw that today. I'm wondering what the background is on that, since it sure seems on the face to be the best solution.

Diomed wrote:

zephyp wrote:Ok, so the same thing then...currently an HB that would grant civil immunity and protection provided no charges or acquittal. VCDL only supports that while strongly supporting letting me shoot a pellet gun in my backyard...whats up with that? Is civil immunity and protection "guaranteed" by common and/or case law and if so can we rest assured based on promises, suppositions, and anecdotal statistics that civil prosecutions are rarely won?

I saw that today. I'm wondering what the background is on that, since it sure seems on the face to be the best solution.

What...civil immunity or pellet guns?

zephyp wrote:

gunderwood wrote:

zephyp wrote:@user - what about civil immunity? That was the whole substance of the one defeated was it not?

No. Castle doctrine and civil immunity are not the same thing although they get rolled together quite often.

The problem with moving the existing common law Castle doctrine into the VA code is that it would allow the legislature of VA to supercede centuries of VA common law protecting us. IMHO, the best thing to do is provide civil immunity as a wholly separate bill.

Ok, so the same thing then...currently an HB that would grant civil immunity and protection provided no charges or acquittal. VCDL only supports that while strongly supporting letting me shoot a pellet gun in my backyard...whats up with that? Is civil immunity and protection "guaranteed" by common and/or case law and if so can we rest assured based on promises, suppositions, and anecdotal statistics that civil prosecutions are rarely won?

When reviewing bills, the VCDL is pretty good about describing their rationale for a support vs. a strong support. It appears that the wording of the immunities bill is not as good as it could be (best to get it right rather than a half-assed effort) and language that would protect current common law and case law was not included in the bill as written: http://www.vcdl.org/pdf/VCDL_Gun_Bill_Analysis_2011.pdf
hence, support but not strong support.

zephyp wrote:

gunderwood wrote:

zephyp wrote:@user - what about civil immunity? That was the whole substance of the one defeated was it not?

No. Castle doctrine and civil immunity are not the same thing although they get rolled together quite often.

The problem with moving the existing common law Castle doctrine into the VA code is that it would allow the legislature of VA to supercede centuries of VA common law protecting us. IMHO, the best thing to do is provide civil immunity as a wholly separate bill.

Ok, so the same thing then...currently an HB that would grant civil immunity and protection provided no charges or acquittal. VCDL only supports that while strongly supporting letting me shoot a pellet gun in my backyard...whats up with that? Is civil immunity and protection "guaranteed" by common and/or case law and if so can we rest assured based on promises, suppositions, and anecdotal statistics that civil prosecutions are rarely won?

From my understanding of that bill it would overturn all of the case law. I.e. you wouldn't have the common law castle doctrine anymore. The only good thing about that bill was civil immunity, but you can do that without giving the keys to the kingdom to politicians. That problem IMHO was that it was a poorly written bill that removes some of the power away from the VA judiciary and to the VA legislature. Like Diomed said, write a good bill and then I'll support it.

zephyp wrote:What...civil immunity or pellet guns?

Civil immunity.

Diomed wrote:

zephyp wrote:What...civil immunity or pellet guns?

Civil immunity.

Indeed.

I went back and re-read both of these bills. So I guess the flap is that they say "inside" and those opposed think that then precludes "outside?"

Two to the chest and that BG won't sue.

I'd like to see a castle doctrine passed you see. If it don't, I'd rather be alive and broke than dead. I'm just sayin' that I'm not defending my castle with small caliber weapons so the chances of said BG being able to call a lawyer from that hot place are slim to none. Now the BG's family can sue. But of the two fellows in the gun fight, I would be the only one who could take the stand.