Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

gunderwood wrote:

cigarmanva wrote: as to the second part of your post, you may need a tax stamp for that......as too the first part, i've got better things to do with my time then argue with you about taht

Did I miss something? Tax stamp for what?

i thought i read that wallet holsters you can fire from without removing the gun required a tax stamp as they were classified as AOW...not sure about that mind you, that's why i said "you may" my google-fu is weak tonight

gunderwood wrote:

cigarmanva wrote:

CowboyT wrote:I recently saw some "wallet holsters" for semi-autos like the Kel-Tecs and the Ruger LCP's and such. They exactly fit the profile of a typical wallet and let you shoot right through the holster. I like that idea for hot summer days like we have now.

as to the second part of your post, you may need a tax stamp for that......as too the first part, i've got better things to do with my time then argue with you about taht

Did I miss something? Tax stamp for what?

There's a little confusion. There are two kinds of wallet holsters at issue here. One covers the whole gun except the trigger, the other leaves the slide exposed as well as the trigger. The former is considered an AOW by ATF, the latter is not. You average wallet holster for a KelTec is federally okay because it doesn't cover enough of the gun. One of the older style wallet holsters for High Standard derringers (for example) calls for the gun to be registered.

I have one of the HS setups. It's neat but it's not easy to shoot.

Diomed wrote:

gunderwood wrote:Did I miss something? Tax stamp for what?

There's a little confusion. There are two kinds of wallet holsters at issue here. One covers the whole gun except the trigger, the other leaves the slide exposed as well as the trigger. The former is considered an AOW by ATF, the latter is not. You average wallet holster for a KelTec is federally okay because it doesn't cover enough of the gun. One of the older style wallet holsters for High Standard derringers (for example) calls for the gun to be registered.

I have one of the HS setups. It's neat but it's not easy to shoot.

How do they get away with classifying a holster as an "Any Other Weapon?" Asinine.

Seriously, when you carry a quick draw situation is not the most likely scenario you're going to find yourself in. Most likely it will be face to face with some scumbag a foot away sticking a gun in your gut...if you are OCing then you are SOL. If you are properly CCing then you stand a chance. Think about what the BG wants...probably your wallet...think about where you should really carry...pretty much just above and slightly to the front of one of your back pockets...if you are in CC mode you now have the opportunity to draw your "wallet" and push the BG's gun aside and defend yourself. If you are OCing that aint gonna happen...especially for those of you proudly displaying a gun squarely on the side of your hip...regarding it being a deterrent yes, but think like a BG...you're gona hide around a corner or in a parking lot and step out in front of your victim...its about that time - when he's already in your face that he sees your carrying...if I were the BG I'd look you straight in the eye, smile, and simply say "no cowboy." Then I'd take your gun and your wallet...unless of course you started doing some kind of ninja dance then you'd just get shot.

More power to you if you can reliably draw and fire your gun while someone has one pointed at you. You seem to be presenting a lot of hypotheticals. Please provide an example of a case where someone Open Carrying a gun was assaulted for that reason. I'll give you a hint; there's only one and there aren't a lot of details.

Well,if the guy asks for your wallet - why else would they stop you with a gun - and you are properly carrying then you stand a good chance to draw and defend yourself. Dont take it from me - ask Bill...he's an expert.

Well, this topic has gotten way off my original intent.

As I said, I picked up an XD 9mm subcompact to go along with my XDM 9mm. Same caliber reduces the need for me to buy all kinds of different ammo, and the same basic feel helps muscle memory. My Crossbreed SuperTuck also arrived, so time to train on drawing from a holster in concealed mode. I'll also see about getting some 1:1 training.

gunderwood wrote:How do they get away with classifying a holster as an "Any Other Weapon?" Asinine.

How do they get away with any of it?

But anyway, the holster is not an AOW. You can have as many operational holsters as you want (much like short rifle barrels). If you have a gun to fit the holster the gun needs to be registered.

Update:

I bought a Galco gun belt from Loudoun Guns. I normally wear 32-33" jeans and bought a 36" belt, but it is too small with the SuperTuck and XDM or the Summer Comfort and Subcompact. Heck, it is smaller and harder to wrap around than my normal belt with no holster - I really gotta cinch it to get it to the first or second hole. Is this normal?

I've been practicing OWB holstering and draws, based on videos and friends' advice. That said, I would prefer to get some hands-on training and just general advice on what works, what doesn't. Any recommendations for trainers/training in NoVA?

Any advice appreciated!

Mindflayer wrote:Update:

I bought a Galco gun belt from Loudoun Guns. I normally wear 32-33" jeans and bought a 36" belt, but it is too small with the SuperTuck and XDM or the Summer Comfort and Subcompact. Heck, it is smaller and harder to wrap around than my normal belt with no holster - I really gotta cinch it to get it to the first or second hole. Is this normal?

I've been practicing OWB holstering and draws, based on videos and friends' advice. That said, I would prefer to get some hands-on training and just general advice on what works, what doesn't. Any recommendations for trainers/training in NoVA?

Any advice appreciated!

NRA Range seems to have some decent instructors.
I hear (read) nothing but good stuff about ProShooter

Diomed wrote:

gunderwood wrote:How do they get away with classifying a holster as an "Any Other Weapon?" Asinine.

How do they get away with any of it?

They have more guns and are willing to use them to enforce stupid and trivial technicalities they make up for job security.

Mindflayer wrote:Update:

I bought a Galco gun belt from Loudoun Guns. I normally wear 32-33" jeans and bought a 36" belt, but it is too small with the SuperTuck and XDM or the Summer Comfort and Subcompact. Heck, it is smaller and harder to wrap around than my normal belt with no holster - I really gotta cinch it to get it to the first or second hole. Is this normal?

I've been practicing OWB holstering and draws, based on videos and friends' advice. That said, I would prefer to get some hands-on training and just general advice on what works, what doesn't. Any recommendations for trainers/training in NoVA?

Any advice appreciated!

Yes, they tend to run a little small for some reason. It is possibly because they are thicker than a normal belt so the radius is changing. Also the holster, even if is OWB, adds some too.

Maybe I need to run a lot more, work off this paunch and get ripped again.

Or I can buy a bigger belt.

what if's are for children and old wash women. A simple fact is that "scumbags" who want to mug you are not going to mug an armed person. Usually the gun they are sticking into the backs of victims are either not loaded or fake. They want to steal money, not kill you. If they wanted you dead, they would shoot you first, then take your money and your CCW.....

People watch too many stupid hero movies.

Some advice, stay away from alleys where crack smokers frequent.
There are parts of communities that you never need to go through, avoid them.
All these useless "hypotheticals" are amusing at best.


It comes down to a will to survive. Ask someone who has been shot or stabbed, or both...


here's a scenario that is more realistic....


a doped up loser sticks a gun in your BACK ( generally speaking he will approach you from the back NOT FACE to FACE!and demands your money.Ask bill, losers who rob people in this fashion are cowards by nature(they cry like babies in the interrogation room) Most of the time they use fake weapons because technicalities in court will get them less time.



In the event you actually get a shot off DURING the robbery(which is almost IMPOSSIBLE except for in the jason bourne movies) and you manage to kill the robber....



His family sues you and in court his lawyer points out that the gun was a toy.

Your lawyer says "your honor my client had no way of knowing if it was real"

and then the judge says " Your client testified that the man stuck something in his back and said "Give me your wallet" ( more likely "gimme yo mutha**$#ing money !....

and your client killed a man for robbery.?

....you now have a 50/50 chance of walking out of that courtroom.


ask Sgt. Bill,

even loser crackheads know enough about true courtroom proceedings to NOT say "gimme yo money or I'll KILL you".

....and before someone "what if's" about your vehicle breaking down and you have to walk through that alley at night..... I would walk through it with my weapon drawn.