Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

Good luck with the PMO. Hope you get a clearly worded okay to carry and use on post.

And thanks for the pdf document. It's great (for service members in Georgia anyway) that in the opinion of the Georgia Assistant Attorney General the problematic paragraph of their code no longer applies. Bet that surprised the judge who asked for clarification!

R/Kurt

If i am not mistaken if your a military, i think you are excuse with the laws of banning in Virginia.

Why does the judge needs clarification? Isn't it over yet?

sog tools

swordfight wrote:If i am not mistaken if your a military, i think you are excuse with the laws of banning in Virginia.

That definitely needs a cite.

It's definitely illegal to carry one concealed. It also appears that § 18.2-31 would make your life very difficult if you carried one openly (albeit not illegal per se).
What a stupid set of laws. You can't even argue that automatics and assisted openers are more deadly than manuals.

t33j wrote:

swordfight wrote:If i am not mistaken if your a military, i think you are excuse with the laws of banning in Virginia.

That definitely needs a cite.

It's definitely illegal to carry one concealed. It also appears that § 18.2-31 would make your life very difficult if you carried one openly (albeit not illegal per se).
What a stupid set of laws. You can't even argue that automatics and assisted openers are more deadly than manuals.

When the Feds were banning switch blades our brilliant politicians actually said that if they banned them gangs would go away! It has been a huge success seeing how we have no gang violence these days...

gunderwood wrote:

t33j wrote:

swordfight wrote:If i am not mistaken if your a military, i think you are excuse with the laws of banning in Virginia.

That definitely needs a cite.

It's definitely illegal to carry one concealed. It also appears that § 18.2-31 would make your life very difficult if you carried one openly (albeit not illegal per se).
What a stupid set of laws. You can't even argue that automatics and assisted openers are more deadly than manuals.

When the Feds were banning switch blades our brilliant politicians actually said that if they banned them gangs would go away! It has been a huge success seeing how we have no gang violence these days...

...and law abiding citizens get to pay the bill (in more ways than one now that I think about it)

I cringe every time I hear, "The government should..."

Great site, I'm glad I stumbled onto it. Lots of great info. Not looking to step on the OP thread, it's good to know that the spring assisted knife is legal in Virginia.
Now I see the list of "thing you can't carry" is pretty extensive based on § 18.2-311 ( I love the prima facie statement)
Now does that list change at all if you have a CCW? or better put aside from a handgun, what else does a Virginia CCW permit you to carry?

cabrera wrote:Now does that list change at all if you have a CCW? or better put aside from a handgun, what else does a Virginia CCW permit you to carry?

In Virginia, it's called a Concealed Handgun Permit because that's all you can legally carry concealed.

and, Welcome to VGOF

Wally626's analysis was correct. I'd add a couple of things. First, in order to be a prohibited weapon, it has to actually be a weapon. So the length and style of the blade will be significant. If yours is only three inches long, but double edged down to a stabbing point with bloodletting grooves, you could have problems. If it's six inches long, but a sheep'sfoot, used for electrical insulation trimming, probably not. Secondly, if a "weapon" is "like" one of those listed, in the opinion of the cop, the prosecutor, and the judge (you don't get any jury on misdemeanors except on appeal) all think that what you're carrying is, in fact, a "weapon", and that it's "like" one of the proscribed classes, you're guilty. So it sort of depends, from county to county. A knife that opens on its own when you push a button or flick a switch is a "switchblade", and it probably won't matter whether that's an "assisted" with a tab on the blade or a true switchblade. "Like" is "like". There was a Court of Appeals decision a while back that said the conviction was valid, because the boxcutter the defendant had was "like" the prohibited "razor". That was overturned in a subsequent case because the Supremes figured that a boxcutter wasn't a "weapon" (though it is "like" a razor).

As a practical matter, "iffy" charges are brought against someone who already has at least one valid charge against him for plea-bargaining purposes. So if they stop you for a busted tail-light, and arrest you for possession of pot, they'll also charge you with concealed weapon and DUI. You plead guilty to the DUI and take a 19.2-251 (first time offense) disposition on the pot, and they'll nolle pros. the other charges. For example.

If you do have confidence that yours is not "like" one of the prohibited classes of knives, and want to tempt fate, do write down my name and phone number off the website, and keep it with you, just in case. When the cop asks you, "What are you doing with a switchblade in your pocket?", say, "I want my lawyer."

user wrote:As a practical matter, "iffy" charges are brought against someone who already has at least one valid charge against him for plea-bargaining purposes. So if they stop you for a busted tail-light, and arrest you for possession of pot, they'll also charge you with concealed weapon and DUI. You plead guilty to the DUI and take a 19.2-251 (first time offense) disposition on the pot, and they'll nolle pros. the other charges. For example.

This IMHO has no place in a common law legal system. Intentionally piling on "iffy" charges to get a guilty plea on a few is tyranny and corruption.

gunderwood wrote:

user wrote:As a practical matter, "iffy" charges are brought against someone who already has at least one valid charge against him for plea-bargaining purposes. So if they stop you for a busted tail-light, and arrest you for possession of pot, they'll also charge you with concealed weapon and DUI. You plead guilty to the DUI and take a 19.2-251 (first time offense) disposition on the pot, and they'll nolle pros. the other charges. For example.

Intentionally piling on "iffy" charges to get a guilty plea on a few is tyranny and corruption.

Unfortunately it is also the world we live in.

gunderwood wrote:

user wrote:As a practical matter, "iffy" charges are brought against someone who already has at least one valid charge against him for plea-bargaining purposes. So if they stop you for a busted tail-light, and arrest you for possession of pot, they'll also charge you with concealed weapon and DUI. You plead guilty to the DUI and take a 19.2-251 (first time offense) disposition on the pot, and they'll nolle pros. the other charges. For example.

This IMHO has no place in a common law legal system. Intentionally piling on "iffy" charges to get a guilty plea on a few is tyranny and corruption.

You got that in one! Question is, what're y'all gonna do about it? Every place I've practiced, or even heard of, does it. And it's much worse in the Federal system and in other states (the same ones who do "gun control", btw). Take a look at my "avatar" and you'll know how I feel about it.

Too many "likes" and "equivalent to" and "opinions" in knife laws.
Get a permit and carry a gun.

SELFDEFENSE wrote:Too many "likes" and "equivalent to" and "opinions" in knife laws.
Get a permit...

or not

SELFDEFENSE wrote:Too many "likes" and "equivalent to" and "opinions" in knife laws.
Get a permit and carry a gun.

Indeed but I want to carry a knife too and without fear of jackbooted thugs harassing me...

Well, a few months ago there was a guy on the forums talking about maybe getting Knife Rights in here to help reverse some of these laws. http://www.kniferights.org/

Jakeiscrazy wrote:Well, a few months ago there was a guy on the forums talking about maybe getting Knife Rights in here to help reverse some of these laws. http://www.kniferights.org/

That was probably me. I've been very busy with other things lately, but have also been researching the statutes here in VA concerning auto knives in particular. I've been comparing them with other states like FL that issue a concealed weapons permit that includes knives, etc. My plan is to draft language taking several different approaches to the problem and asking friends in the House of Delegates to sponsor them. Making the CHP a CWP will definitely be one approach. I'll probably run my initial language past kniferights for their thoughts to get the benefit of their experience elsewhere.

I don't anticipate that this will be an easy project, nor that it will be quick. But I'm taking a realistic, long view.

Sort of like mating elephants;;;;; Takes a very long time and makes a hell of a lot of noise!

But if successful, the new birth that results is a wonder to behold!

Adding other weapons to the concealed pistol permit would obviously be helpful, but some knifes are not allowed for open carry either:

§ 18.2-311. Prohibiting the selling or having in possession blackjacks, etc.

If any person sells or barters, or exhibits for sale or for barter, or gives or furnishes, or causes to be sold, bartered, given or furnished, or has in his possession, or under his control, with the intent of selling, bartering, giving or furnishing, any ... switchblade knife, ballistic knife, or like weapons, ...

This is a subset of the concealed carry list from the concealed carry list:

§ 18.2-308. Personal protection; carrying concealed weapons; when lawful to carry.

A. If any person carries about his person, hidden from common observation, (i) any ...dirk, bowie knife, switchblade knife, ballistic knife, machete, razor, ..(v) any weapon of like kind as those enumerated in this subsection.

So making the concealed carry permit a concealed weapon permit would allow bowie knives, machetes, razors and weapons of like kind that are not like switchblades or ballistic knives.

I think in practice very few have been arrested for carrying a concealed knife unless they have been also arrested for something else.