Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

I don't recall any competency test. Had to attend a four hour class that was on a fourth grade level - basically, "this is a handgun. If you come across one, find an adult." It was a torturous four hours.
I can say I am no more competent today than before I took the class.

wvishome wrote:so according to you guys nobody better ever defend themselves while open carrying with no training. Got it.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

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Don't think anybody said that; or anything like that. BUT, if you ever do have to shoot anybody, don't expect the Commonwealth's Attorney, the police, or the family of the dude you shot to pat you on the head and tell you what a good boy you are.

I live in New Castle, Va. I don't recall a physical competency test either.

I took an online test through 11BravoTraining.com - a neighbor is president ($20.00 for 20 questions) printed the results, went to the clerk, paid my $15.00, took the oath and she said the Sheriff is out today (it was a Friday). She ran a BG check, said they would call me about Tue or Wed next week. They called Wed and I went and picked it up, they laminated it for me and away I went.

She also said a copy of a DD214 (military discharge) would suffice for the training/testing.

dmharvey wrote:I set my own standard for this requirement when I first applied, with my thought being 'what do I want to present in court as proof of my training/competency should I ever be required to do so'. In my opinion a prosecutor could have a field day with somebody if they have to defend the use of deadly force by presenting a hunter's safety certificate, DD-214, etc. That said, when I first applied for a CPL (in Michigan) I took a 4-day course at a local college's police academy which included 'crime avoidance' lectures, discussions of legal topics with the local assistant prosecutor, and the standard stuff like firearm safety, fundamentals of marksmanship, etc.

Just something for each person to consider if they decide to apply...do they want to do so under the minimum requirements?

You sir, should be commended. Well done!

dorminWS wrote:
And besides, a little extra training won't hurt you none, nohow; RIGHT, Proshooter?

Hehehe......do I really need to answer that? LOL!

wittmeba wrote:I live in New Castle, Va. I don't recall a physical competency test either.

I took an online test through 11BravoTraining.com - a neighbor is president ($20.00 for 20 questions) printed the results, went to the clerk, paid my $15.00, took the oath and she said the Sheriff is out today (it was a Friday). She ran a BG check, said they would call me about Tue or Wed next week. They called Wed and I went and picked it up, they laminated it for me and away I went.

She also said a copy of a DD214 (military discharge) would suffice for the training/testing.

Let me ask....I don't need a name, but how did your instructor sign your certificate? What instructor credential did he list?

ProShooter - no problem.

Joseph E. Coty
NRA Instructor Number 74010467

Joe Coty | Lead Firearms Instructor

Joe Coty is a NRA certified pistol instructor who teaches handgun and concealed carry courses in southwest Virginia, and is active in IDPA (International Defensive Pistol Association) shooting competitions. He is a graduate of numerous tactical courses at PFT (Practical Firearms Training), facility in West Virginia, including handgun, advanced handgun, force-on-force, tactical carbine courses, as well as numerous custom designed, advanced handgun courses.

Contact Joe via email at joe@11bravotraining.com

From this link:
http://www.11bravotraining.com/about-us.html

And I agree with others - more training probably will not hurt.

The NRA has a policy prohibiting its instructors from using their NRA instructor credentials in conjunction with an online course. I don't agree with this policy, especially since the NRA itself began offering some online courses such as Range Safety Officer for NRA instructors. Regardless, I suspect this policy is why ProShooter asked the question.

wittmeba wrote:ProShooter - no problem.

Joseph E. Coty
NRA Instructor Number 74010467

Chasbo00 wrote:The NRA has a policy prohibiting its instructors from using their NRA instructor credentials in conjunction with an online course. I don't agree with this policy, especially since the NRA itself began offering some online courses such as Range Safety Officer for NRA instructors. Regardless, I suspect this policy is why ProShooter asked the question.

Thank you.

Chasbo00 hit the nail on the head. You (and others, I am sure) have a certificate issued by an instructor who knowingly violated NRA rules by using his credentials to run an online course. In essence, he was teaching outside of his certification.

What could (conceivably) happen here, is that the NRA could revoke his instructor creds. I hate to say this to you wittmeba, but since your certificate was issued in such a manner, the NRA could say its null and void, and if they start contacting courts, CHP's may be revoked since the training documents were issued by the instructor fraudulently.

As a suggestion, you may want to contact the instructor and seek a refund.

Here is the NRA policy:

http://www.nrablog.com/post/2011/11/08/ ... pdate.aspx

It's nearly three years old now and the statement about the only NRA online training program being Refuse To Be A Victim is no longer true.

Chasbo00 wrote:Here is the NRA policy:

http://www.nrablog.com/post/2011/11/08/ ... pdate.aspx

It's nearly three years old now and the statement about the only NRA online training program being Refuse To Be A Victim is no longer true.

Yep, that's the memo I was speaking of.

Now, I will say that the NRA is moving their NRA Basic Pistol Shooting class into a blended format with some of it online and some with an live instructor. I'm hopeful that it will work out, although we haven't seen any details yet. Even that though, is at the authority of the NRA - These online courses are not.

I've never cared for shooting courses that don't actually involve live fire. Moving most of the knowledge only portions of a shooting course from the classroom to online is a smart move that will allow folks with limited time during normal training times more opportunities for training.

Finding a place to shoot that is flexible, affordable and nearby is still the main challenge for most of us. I'm a bit surprised no one has yet come up with a high fidelity shooting simulator that truly replicates firing a handgun at a reasonable cost. All the shooting simulators I'm aware of don't even come close to replicating the recoil and muzzle blast of a service handgun. Trigger pulls, trigger reset and reloading usually don't get much consideration by the designers either. Current shooting simulators are a big disappointment for me. As a former military aviator, I know what can be done training wise with good simulators and I also know how close to reality they can be.

Perhaps we are getting close. It may now be cheaper to start employing high-end simulators rather than paying out all that is associated with operating a live fire range full time. We'll see.

Sorry if my input upset you "wvishome". Do whatever you feel is right and best of luck to you should something ever go down.

Thanks for the heads-up. I have contacted Joe and will see what he says.

Not attempting to make excuses I suspect from the link provided the NRA is more concerned with those using NRA in their site/schooling programs. 11BravoTraining does not do this. They indicated (may be on their website) that any concerns by any Virginia Clerk Office with anyone trying to obtain their CWP to contact 11BravoTraining for information and they would handle any disputes. There was no issue for me when I presented the certificate to the clerk.

Now, whether Joe is possibly in personal trouble with the NRA, I don't know.

It turns out as I suspected. The 11BravoTraining is not nor suggesting to be a NRA course. It is the basic training required by the State of Va to obtain the CWP.

I am certainly not against live training but it becomes an issue just like all the 2A issues. The libs want to make everything a "requirement" making it more difficult for many to exercise their God given rights.

It would a greater concern to me with the younger generation of those who have not been around guns, no military training or experience. I would hope they would see the benefit.

wittmeba wrote:It turns out as I suspected. The 11BravoTraining is not nor suggesting to be a NRA course. It is the basic training required by the State of Va to obtain the CWP.

It doesn't have to be suggested as being an NRA course. The mere fact that an NRA instructor listed "NRA instructor 123456789" on the cert is enough. An NRA instructor is prohibited by the NRA from doing that. That should invalidate the cert since it was issued outside of the NRA's requirements.

The certificate must also state "This is not an NRA approved course" in a font at least the same size as the course title.

I have sent this link to Joe for comment.

http://www.nrablog.com/post/2011/11/08/ ... pdate.aspx