Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

LOL,
The great debate of the AK versus the AR continues!

What you all are trying to ignore is that the Mosin trumps all! Mu-ha-ha-ha-ha!

Well, I solved the debate, I have both an AK and a few ARs lol...


Si vis pacem para bellum

follow me @DiscipleofJMB - GO PENS!

I know this thread is a little dead but for those perusing through I thought it might be interesting to see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfGnz38K9ik

Hey! Nothing's dead when it comes to the "AK vs AR" debate, the "9mm vs .45 ACP" debate, the "Glock vs 1911" debate

Sheeeeeaaattt! You get more than 6 shooters in a circle, and time vanishes as someone will argue some point or another...

and I like my AR, but I LOVE my AK'S!

I replaced the stock safety lever on my Arsenal AK to a Krebs Custom Mk VI. Now I can go from safe to fire using only my trigger finger.

http://www.krebscustom.com/ak-safety.aspx

They also make levers for Saiga receivers and under folders.

Reverenddel wrote:Hey! Nothing's dead when it comes to the "AK vs AR" debate, the "9mm vs .45 ACP" debate, the "Glock vs 1911" debate

Sheeeeeaaattt! You get more than 6 shooters in a circle, and time vanishes as someone will argue some point or another...

and I like my AR, but I LOVE my AK'S!

SO TRUE! Like you i can respect both firearms and the Krebs Mod. is an amazing add on too.

I saw some AKs in Afghanistan that looked like they'd lived a hard life and they still functioned pretty well. The number of them in existence, and the number of places they're used around the world, has to say something about the AK. It is a great gun for it's intended purpose and I doubt it will be replaced for many years to come.

docapos wrote:I know this thread is a little dead but for those perusing through I thought it might be interesting to see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfGnz38K9ik

You can train around many things, but it still doesn't mean it's an ideal location for a safety selector. That motion works, but it's hardly the most efficient design/motion available.

dmharvey wrote:I saw some AKs in Afghanistan that looked like they'd lived a hard life and they still functioned pretty well. The number of them in existence, and the number of places they're used around the world, has to say something about the AK. It is a great gun for it's intended purpose and I doubt it will be replaced for many years to come.

For their intended purpose, they're an excellent design. They're cheap to manufacturer. They're hard to break (not impossible like the legends). They don't require much maintenance. They're easy to operate at a basic level. For all of that you get a rifle that is heavy, generally inaccurate, and has some obvious flaws (venting gas into your support hand, safety selector position, sights are a joke, etc.). Given their intended users (unskilled peasants), none of those deficiencies matter and the AK is awesome.

It might not be the most accurate thing, but it was good enough to give grief in SWA, Afghanistan (Soviet Union's "Vietnam"), Africa, etc. Sure, weapons and their accuracy is important, but other factors exist, too. Good 'nuff is sometimes good enough, I guess?

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GeneFrenkle wrote:It might not be the most accurate thing, but it was good enough to give grief in SWA, Afghanistan (Soviet Union's "Vietnam"), Africa, etc. Sure, weapons and their accuracy is important, but other factors exist, too. Good 'nuff is sometimes good enough, I guess?

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Of course accuracy isn't everything, otherwise we'd all be carrying around ~20lbs tactical rifles. On the other hand, much of the AKs famed abilities are due to it's loose tolerances which are one reason it's inaccurate. Also, to keep ammo as cheap as possible, 7.62x39 isn't usually loaded with Vihtavuori powder, Berger bullets and Lapua brass...if you get my drift.

I understand, Gunderwood. I can also see where you're going with this - secretly, you're a big Mini fan.

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GeneFrenkle wrote:I understand, Gunderwood. I can also see where you're going with this - secretly, you're a big Mini fan.

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Nope, I'll take my ARs. Perfect? Not by a long shot, but I do think they are the best all around platform.

Ahight, maybe you and grumpy can agree that the following two noted expert findings can contribute significantly to this:

The Gunny: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuwR4LL ... ata_player

Ashley Dugan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhGih7eWI3E

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Oh, the second one - some harsh language.... whoops, sorry.

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It is really too bad they didn't keep the SKS safety on the AK. I really like my SKS's safety. It was easy on, easy off, dead deer. AK safety, not so much. Safety on, in the woods, safety off, finger off the trigger, safety on....wait wait wait...slowly quietly safety off, dead deer.

GeneFrenkle wrote:Ahight, maybe you and grumpy can agree that the following two noted expert findings can contribute significantly to this:

The Gunny: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuwR4LL ... ata_player

Ashley Dugan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhGih7eWI3E

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I like the Krebs one finger safety.

As for accuracy? I have one of the longer barrelled with an aftermarket gas piston covers, decent rounds (AKA AMERICAN AMMO) and out to about 500 meters? I'm hitting 50 gallon drums rather centerly.

LOL thanks Genefrenkle those vids were pretty good

Enjoyable post - for my .02 I'd like to point out that this rifle was designed in the late 1940's by a Russian Army tank mechanic. Also, I think the Russian Spetsnaz guys are trained to use their support hand for manipulating both the safety and the charging handle. They're also pretty damn good at changing mags using a fresh mag to lob out the spent one, a skill I've practiced but am still lousy at....

That being said, its hard to fault an AK for functionality - those things will run almost without regard to outside conditions or circumstances. At the risk of starting some sort of flame war, for engagements of <=100M I'd take an AK over an AR any day. I own both, have worked on both, built both, and love both platforms, but the fact of the matter for me is that AK's run, and AR's can be finicky under certain circumstances....an AK is a "seat of the pants" type of gun to me - in fact most of mine are iron sights only, whereas the AR is more of a precision weapon to be sure, and I've got a couple that are adorned with all sorts of high-end optics, trigger groups, furniture, etc. etc. etc.

Anyway, that's my .02

GeneFrenkle wrote:Ahight, maybe you and grumpy can agree that the following two noted expert findings can contribute significantly to this:

The Gunny: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuwR4LL ... ata_player

Ashley Dugan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhGih7eWI3E

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Love it!