Now THIS is a LEO encounter!

[firstcavapache64]

Gunderwood, I have been away from the forum for a while due to health reasons. Thanks again to the Veterans Hospital, but it's good to see you're still playing nicely with others.

[Yarddawg]

Not only am I an LEO but I have a degree in criminal law and I am an instructor in law enforcement.

Well, I guess that settles it then, huh? My gosh you come across as an arrogant a$$! I've got news for you Mr. I have a degree, that degree does not make you intelligent, it makes you someone who met the MINIMUM standards to obtain that piece of paper.

I am an instructor as well. With an attitude like yours, I would not be a very effective one.

[Palladin]

Gunderwood, I have been away from the forum for a while due to health reasons. Thanks again to the Veterans Hospital, but it's good to see you're still playing nicely with others.

Welcome back John! Looking forward to Bill's this Spring. Now if we could just find Elliot...

[gunderwood]

Gunderwood, I have been away from the forum for a while due to health reasons. Thanks again to the Veterans Hospital, but it's good to see you're still playing nicely with others.

Glad to hear you are doing better. Hope you make it out to Bills in May.

[SgtBill]

I must say that I am very happy that I stayed out of this one. Even with my 2 degrees in criminal science and criminal justice along with my 25 years exp. in law enforcement I know that I can not hold a candel to Garett and his ability to do research and post the fact's as they are written.
Good job Garett.
Bill

[Kuda]

Garett (and sbcpd10) -
Thanks for the quick and sometimes dirty rundown on our basic rights when being detained (legally & illegally). I appreciate it for it helps me better understand my rights in this uncommunistwealth of VA.

As an outsider looking in, I appreciate the respect to LEOs Garett expressed. In no manner did he slander or degrade the conversation. He kindly stated his opinions at the same time backing them up with copious amounts of regs, case law, etc.

An important aspect I think was glossed over in the conversation (no, this is not to ignite anything further), is that LEOs have, in my personal highly unbiased opinion, a disgusting job. They are always dealing with the scum of the earth, life threatening unknowns, and me as I race down the road 15 miles over the speed limit. This is the reason why I, knowing my rights, make it as comfortable as I can for them until they know who they are dealing with (lights on in the vehicle, windows down, car turned off, no movement until requested). Again, this is my choice, and by no means do I disagree with folks who stand up for their rights. But by making the situation comfortable for the LEO, the situation is squashed, I go away, the LEO goes away and when I encounter them again, the situation is that much smoother.

Some may disagree with my actions (which they can) for they believe this creates a common course of actions that will slowly and inevitable eat away our rights. Correct. But there is a war out there, a big war, and we must pick our battles (luckily I am in a forum that understands this is a figure of speech and I am not trying to start an actual war). I am thankful for those who fight the battles for our rights (including our troops) because not every one has the ability to do so (monetary, professional, schedule reasons). But as a community, when we stick together, look out for each other, we can keep a fair and balanced system.

So with that, thanks Garett and all those allowing for the discussion to take its course. I thank Skidmark for all he is doing. And I thank the forum for allowing all to voice their opinions, rights, and occasional humor which allows the community to survive.

v/r
PGK

[gunderwood]

This is the reason why I, knowing my rights, make it as comfortable as I can for them until they know who they are dealing with (lights on in the vehicle, windows down, car turned off, no movement until requested).

IMHO, the two are not mutually exclusive. The last time I was pulled over was because the tail lights on the van I borrowed failed while driving home. I wasn't far, but as luck would have it a local Sheriff pulled me over. I could actually see my house at that point. He was polite, kept it professional and I did as you described. I was carrying, but I didn't inform him as it wasn't relevant to the stop. Like the video, you should be firm, but not rude. Being rude will get you nowhere. However, I think standing for our rights is important unless we want to live in a country where we can be searched without cause, etc.

[Reverenddel]

I think I have told this story before, but it illustrates the differences in opinion, and attitudes towards CITIZENS!

I walked into a Kroger in Carytown, and there was an older female uniformed LEO for RPD. She saw I had a pocket knife, and said "Excuse me, do you have a permit for that knife?"

To which I replied "No, but I have one for the 9mm at the small of my back."

She laughed, waved me off, and said "Go 'head baby! Have a good evenin'."

Could she have been an ass? SURE! Was she? NOPE! I have generally been pleased with my interactions with LEO's and my carrying a firearm.

sbcpd10 with only 9 posts, and a recent joining, and you want to go Toe-to-Toe with Garrett!?!?

Oh C'mon! If you have EVER read him, you know he has resources that could make Judge GINSBERG stop in her tracks, and go "Wait.. hold up... lemme check that..."

HAHAHAHAHA You punch Kodiaks for fun brotha?!?!? Seriously man! You got to bring your "A" game with him on a debate!

[SgtBill]

HAHAHAHAHA You punch Kodiaks for fun brotha?!?!? Seriously man! You got to bring your "A" game with him on a debate!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Punch Kodiaks for fun, man I almost peed myself.
LOL
Bill

[Taggure]

What a way to spend a lunch hour reading this post.

Now on the serious side of this entertaining thread; this does however show the mentality that you may come accross in the everyday process of exercising your right here in Virgina of OC.

[zephyp]

Oh C'mon! If you have EVER read him, you know he has resources that could make Judge GINSBERG stop in her tracks, and go "Wait.. hold up... lemme check that..."

His biggest one is probably a little thing called google and a good understanding of how it works...

[gunderwood]

Oh C'mon! If you have EVER read him, you know he has resources that could make Judge GINSBERG stop in her tracks, and go "Wait.. hold up... lemme check that..."

His biggest one is probably a little thing called google and a good understanding of how it works...

+1

I have some books, but I certainly am not pulling them out unless I need too. Google is a much faster tool. Knowing how to use it is important, but it can't help you unless you have a fairly good idea of what you are looking for. I read, I learn, then I use Google to find the references I need; i.e. recall searching.

[b2unit]

Excellent thread and debate from "gunderwood". New around here, but not to this issue. Most of my LEO friends (and wife) would agree with your thoughts and deal with the public accordingly.

Hot-headed come backs and authoritarian blather do little to garner sympathy, especially when espoused via the internet. If you can't keep your cool while staring at a 2-5 pound piece of plastic, I certainly would not like to cross paths and see how you deal with stress in real life.


B2

[WRW]

Excellent thread and debate from "gunderwood". New around here, but not to this issue. Most of my LEO friends (and wife) would agree with your thoughts and deal with the public accordingly.

Hot-headed come backs and authoritarian blather do little to garner sympathy, especially when espoused via the internet. If you can't keep your cool while staring at a 2-5 pound piece of plastic, I certainly would not like to cross paths and see how you deal with stress in real life.


B2

LOL! oh, wait. That really isn't funny, though it is a good point.

[Reverenddel]

Well aware of Google, and it's benefits, but like G said, you have to KNOW how to use it!

(Referee)

Game Match! GUNDERWOOD!

[zephyp]

Well aware of Google, and it's benefits, but like G said, you have to KNOW how to use it!

(Referee)

Game Match! GUNDERWOOD!

Yes, I said that too. If you dont understand how they work then you're just poking through several hundred thousand hits. I've been using search engines since the days of Infoseek which I doubt many here remember...

[Taggure]

Well aware of Google, and it's benefits, but like G said, you have to KNOW how to use it!

(Referee)

Game Match! GUNDERWOOD!

Yes, I said that too. If you dont understand how they work then you're just poking through several hundred thousand hits. I've been using search engines since the days of Infoseek which I doubt many here remember...

Watch out DK you are dating yourself. Was that after PacMan and before TRON?

[zephyp]

@Vern - almost right after the first browser was released on diskette...not sure about Pacman but it was after Asteroids...

[Taggure]

I remember the days

AHH yes the BBS days of screaming network connections and blazing processor speeds (of the VIC and the Commodor 64) The hole punch to make the 5 1/4 SSD into DSD.

Ok back to this dead thread.