State Police Weapons Qualification

Bewaffnet · Post by **Bewaffnet** » Fri, 26 Mar 2010 13:27:12

I would like to be able to meet the VSP pistol qualification standards since it's a good indication of your skills should you ever have to defend yourself in court after a self defense shooting. I have a copy of the shooting test but it doesn't seem quite right. The test has the officers shooting "hip shooting" and "point shoulder position" as well as kneeling strong hand and weak hand. It looks like the qualification requires all one-handed shooting. Anyone know if this is true or am I reading it wrong?

Also, anyone know what their shotgun qualification standards consist of?

Any help would be appreciated.

Post by **OakRidgeStars** » Fri, 26 Mar 2010 15:35:58

I would be interested in reading that myself. Is it something you can post here?

ProShooter · Post by **ProShooter** » Fri, 26 Mar 2010 16:04:51

You are reading it incorectly. If you can post the qual course here, we can help.

Bewaffnet · Post by **Bewaffnet** » Fri, 26 Mar 2010 18:03:33

Here ya go. This is what I have from a file named "VA LEOSA Qualification". I forget where I got it from. I cut out section 2 which dealt with semiautos in order to save space.

Virginia Authorized Firearms Qualifications Courses
Every criminal justice officer required to carry a firearm in the performance of duty shall qualify annually using the applicable firearms course set forth
below. Annual range qualification shall include a review of issues/policy
relating to weapons safety, nomenclature, maintenance and use of force

1. Virginia Modified Double Action Course For Revolvers.
Target - Silhouette (B21, B21X, B27, Q)
60 rounds
Double action only
Minimum qualifying score - 70%

a. Phase 1: 7 yards, hip shooting, crouch position, 24 rounds
Load 6 rounds, fire 1 round on whistle (2 seconds), repeat or fire 2 rounds on whistle (3 seconds), repeat
Load 6 rounds, fire 2 rounds on whistle (3 seconds), repeat
Load 6 rounds, fire 12 rounds on whistle (30 seconds)

b. Phase 2: 15 yards, point shoulder position, 18 rounds
Load 6 rounds, fire 1 round on whistle (2 seconds), repeat or fire 2 rounds on whistle (3 seconds), repeat
Load 6 rounds, fire 2 rounds on whistle (3 seconds), repeat
Load 6 rounds, fire 6 rounds on whistle (12 seconds)

c. Phase 3: 25 yards, 90 seconds, 18 rounds
Load 6 rounds, on whistle:
fire 6 rounds, kneeling, strong hand; reload
fire 6 rounds, standing behind barricade, weak hand;
reload fire 6 rounds, standing behind barricade, strong hand (kneeling position may be fired using barricade)

d. Scoring.
(1) B21, B21X targets: use indicated K value with a maximum 300 points; divide by 3 to obtain percentage.
(2) B27 target: 8, 9, 10, X rings - value 5 points; 7 ring - value 4 points; other hits on silhouette - value 3 points; divide by 3 to obtain percentage.
(3) Q targets: any fired round striking the bottle area to its marked border - value 5 points, any fired round striking outside the bottle area - value 3 points.

3. Virginia 50 round Tactical Qualification Course for Revolvers and Semiautomatic Pistols.

Target - silhouette (B21, B21X, B-27, Q) Minimum Qualifying Score 70%

a. Each officer is restricted to the number of magazines carried on duty. Magazines shall be loaded to full capacity. The range instructor shall determine when magazines will be changed.
b. Phase 1: On 5 or 7 yard line or fraction thereof, point shoulder shooting, fire 2 rounds on command in 3 seconds for 12 rounds. Between each 2 rounds holster, repeat until all rounds have been fired.
(1) On command, draw and fire 6 rounds in 8 seconds from point shoulder positions.
(2) On command draw and fire 4 rounds strong hand only, point shoulder point in 8 seconds.
(3) On command, fire 4 rounds, weak hand only, point shoulder position in 10 seconds.

c. Phase 2: 15 yard point shoulder position
(1) On command, draw and fire 2 rounds in 3 seconds for 6 (optional to re-holster after each 2 rounds)
(2) On command, draw and fire 6 rounds in 12 seconds, holster.

d. Phase 3: 25 yard, kneeling and standing position on command, assume a kneeling position, draw weapon and fire 6 rounds behind a barricade, than fire 6 rounds strong hand, standing barricade position, until a total of 12 rounds have been fired for a total of 45 seconds for semi-automatic pistols or 60 seconds for revolvers. A kneeling position may be fired using a barricade.)

e. Scoring:
(1) B21, B21x targets: use indicated K value with a minimum of 250 points: Multiply by.4 to obtain percentage.
(2) B27 target: 8, 9 and 10 X rings-value 5 points, 7 ring - value 4 points, other hits on silhouette - value 3 points; multiply by.4 to obtain percent.
(3) Q target: any fired round striking the bottle area to its marked border - value 5 points, any fired round striking outside the bottle area - value 3 points.

SgtBill · Post by **SgtBill** » Fri, 26 Mar 2010 18:34:45

Hip shooting is from the old F.B.I. day's when you would draw your weapon and place your weak hand in a fist on your chest and fire from the hip level at your target. This has been changed over the years to the point where you draw your weapon and use both hands for a firmer grip bring the weapon up to the eye while you drop your but down several inches in a semi crouch and fire your weapon without the use of the sight's. At 7 yard's it might take some practice but it is a simple thing to do and place all shot's in the center mass area.

Point shoulder shooting is basicly the same thing at 15 yard's but now you will use the sight's. Again with practice you should be able to keep all the rounds in the center mass area.
Bill

GS78 · Post by **GS78** » Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:45:14

can't we just call in artie?....

Post by **zephyp** » Sat, 27 Mar 2010 07:54:49

Hip shooting is generally your only sensible option when engaging threats inside your personal space. If someone stops you on the street and has a gun a foot from your gut you have no other choice unless you submit to their demands....

SgtBill · Post by **SgtBill** » Sat, 27 Mar 2010 08:09:04

GS78 wrote:can't we just call in artie?....

Hell yes. Call Custer and Attila the Hun. Just get my ass out of there!
Lol Bill

Bewaffnet · Post by **Bewaffnet** » Wed, 31 Mar 2010 16:05:07

Sorry it took so long to check in. The recent stroms had my satellite internet down.

So I guess that the VA State Police qualification requires point shooting at close range and standard 2-handed shooting at farther distances. That makes sense to me. Thank you one-and-all for the clarification.

GS78 · Post by **GS78** » Wed, 31 Mar 2010 16:24:04

zephyp wrote:Hip shooting is generally your only sensible option when engaging threats inside your personal space. If someone stops you on the street and has a gun a foot from your gut you have no other choice unless you submit to their demands....

A foot from your gut is deep inside your space, and you could disarm them .

Post by **zephyp** » Wed, 31 Mar 2010 17:47:17

GS78 wrote:
zephyp wrote:Hip shooting is generally your only sensible option when engaging threats inside your personal space. If someone stops you on the street and has a gun a foot from your gut you have no other choice unless you submit to their demands....
A foot from your gut is deep inside your space, and you could disarm them .

I prefer the technique of disarming them while shooting them in the gut...you can do it so it looks as if you're being cooperative right up until it goes bang...I refuse to chance that me or an innocent bystander get shot because I tried to be a hero and leave my gun holstered to disarm a thug...

SgtBill · Post by **SgtBill** » Wed, 31 Mar 2010 20:15:17

GS78 wrote:
zephyp wrote:Hip shooting is generally your only sensible option when engaging threats inside your personal space. If someone stops you on the street and has a gun a foot from your gut you have no other choice unless you submit to their demands....
A foot from your gut is deep inside your space, and you could disarm them .

This is very true,but not everyone is trained to disarm people that pull a gun or knife on them. I am, and I will still shoot them if presented with the opertunity. It takes a lot less effort to pull a trigger then to fight some asswipe that placed himself or herself in that position.
I don't play nice with others.
Bill

GS78 · Post by **GS78** » Wed, 31 Mar 2010 20:29:25

zephyp wrote:
GS78 wrote:
zephyp wrote:Hip shooting is generally your only sensible option when engaging threats inside your personal space. If someone stops you on the street and has a gun a foot from your gut you have no other choice unless you submit to their demands....
A foot from your gut is deep inside your space, and you could disarm them .
I prefer the technique of disarming them while shooting them in the gut...you can do it so it looks as if you're being cooperative right up until it goes bang...I refuse to chance that me or an innocent bystander get shot because I tried to be a hero and leave my gun holstered to disarm a thug...

it really doesn't have a thing to do with "being a hero" its survival. In the scenario you describe, it would be easier to disarm the man without drawing my weapon.

I will say I admire your concern for innocent bystanders though. The way I look at it, if the bad guy has a gun pointing at my gut and is one foot away, I can guarantee that in my mind we are the only two people on the planet....until I break his arm in a couple places and kick him square in the face as hard and fast as I can once he is on the ground.

Post by **zephyp** » Wed, 31 Mar 2010 22:30:37

@GS78 - I'd much rather do something like - "sure, please dont hurt me. I'll give you my wallet." Reaching for my wallet and gut shoot the twit while I push his gun out of the way...I'd much rather try to disarm them with one hand while I'm giving them my "wallet" with the other...

GS78 · Post by **GS78** » Thu, 01 Apr 2010 06:13:45

zephyp wrote:@GS78 - I'd much rather do something like - "sure, please dont hurt me. I'll give you my wallet." Reaching for my wallet and gut shoot the twit while I push his gun out of the way...I'd much rather try to disarm them with one hand while I'm giving them my "wallet" with the other...

I hear ya...but now that leads to me this question; does everyone here, carry their weapon(s) everywhere, without exception? If not absolutely without exception, what are you 'trained' to do "if" you are put in a defensive situation without one ?

I ask what are you trained to do, because we all here rely on our training with firearms in that situation, I am just wondering how much time have any invested in training without one. This really calls for more of an introspective answer....

GS78 · Post by **GS78** » Thu, 01 Apr 2010 06:36:03

SgtBill wrote:
GS78 wrote:can't we just call in artie?....
Hell yes. Call Custer and Attila the Hun. Just get my ass out of there!
Lol Bill

Thats right bill, "whatever it takes!, as long as it TAKES MY SORRY ASS OUTTA HERE!!

....and if I gotta be dragged......drag me backwards so I can still

Post by **zephyp** » Thu, 01 Apr 2010 07:18:04

GS78 wrote:
zephyp wrote:@GS78 - I'd much rather do something like - "sure, please dont hurt me. I'll give you my wallet." Reaching for my wallet and gut shoot the twit while I push his gun out of the way...I'd much rather try to disarm them with one hand while I'm giving them my "wallet" with the other...
I hear ya...but now that leads to me this question; does everyone here, carry their weapon(s) everywhere, without exception? If not absolutely without exception, what are you 'trained' to do "if" you are put in a defensive situation without one ?

I ask what are you trained to do, because we all here rely on our training with firearms in that situation, I am just wondering how much time have any invested in training without one. This really calls for more of an introspective answer....

The only place I dont carry is to work...cant do that but wish I could...

SgtBill · Post by **SgtBill** » Thu, 01 Apr 2010 08:57:22

About 15 year's ago when I retired from New Jersey and moved here I stoped carrying. I had been carrying some type of firearm since I turned 17 and was inducted into the Marine's. At the ripe old age of 47 I retired and had been carrying a firearm everyday almost for 30 year's and had been forced to use them on many occasions. I suppose I just got tired of always carrying. Now at the ripe old age of 63 I carry everyday, why! because I am not a young guy anymore that likes to go toe to toe with people and I have physical limitations that prevent me from doing the things that I was able to do years ago and now in this state and as a retired Police Sergeant I can. I refuse to be a victum or see my wife or anyone else placed in any type of danger from some sucmbag. Yes I will shoot another person in a heartbeat if I have to.It never get's easier but I will do what I have to do to survive.
Bill

9MMDerringer · Post by **9MMDerringer** » Thu, 01 Apr 2010 13:35:24

It has been a few years (5 to 6 years) but I remember at DC Police we used to draw and hip shoot from 3 yards when the target turned. We had like 3 seconds to draw and shoot 3 shots in to center mass when our target turned towards us. It was one handed shooting (strong arm).
This was part of the DC Police course back in like 2004 to 2005!

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