Minnesota police kill concealed carry holder during stop

[scott9050]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/mor ... ge%2Fstory

Sounds like cold blooded murder. The video is on Youtube, I will not post it.

[wittmeba]

I read on one article that the driver who was killed had a CWP. I don't see this indicated on all the stories. It will be interesting to learn for certain more details of this incident. Does not sound good on the surface. Neither does the Baton Rouge story.

[mamabearCali]

It does not look good at all.

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[scott9050]

My understanding of the story is that he told the officer first that he had a CCW and had his pistol. The officer then asked him to get out his wallet. When he did as asked, the cop pulled out his weapon and opened fire.

[SHMIV]

The whole BLM thing is very counter-intuitive. Of course, it's designed to be.

Officers are likely on edge. So, that makes me wonder if this, and Baton Rouge, are really cold blooded murders, or bad decisions caused by jumpy nerves. Don't get me wrong; I'm not attempting to justify either shooting. But, as anti-police sentiment grows, I'm not surprised when officers misread a situation and shoot when they ought not be shooting.

Looking at pictures of Mr. Castile, I am reminded that appearance does matter. The guy appears to have emulated a thuggish style of dress. If his manner of speech was similar to that of his girlfriend, I can see where he might have come off as somewhat "gangsta".

Again, not justifying anything, just making an observation.

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[Reverenddel]

Dude in Minnesota told the Cop "I have a CHP", the cop said "Get your license", then shot him 4 times...

and it's on video...

...and the Chief said "I am appalled at this behavior, and have questions as well. In that stead, I am asking the U.S. Attorney General's office to investigate to mitigate any accusations of covering things up, and will stand by their findings."

At least the Chief of Police realizes "You effed up something fierce."

[dorminWS]

This thing that struck me about that Youtube video was that the cop appeared to be hysterical. Makes me wonder if the party that had no business carrying a gun might not have been the cop. Very disturbing.

[WRW]

This thing that struck me about that Youtube video was that the cop appeared to be hysterical. Makes me wonder if the party that had no business carrying a gun might not have been the cop. Very disturbing.

That's right. Small town force with small town training budget and no idea how best to safely effect a traffic stop. Perhaps that "duty to inform" isn't such a good idea.

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[Reverenddel]

This thing that struck me about that Youtube video was that the cop appeared to be hysterical. Makes me wonder if the party that had no business carrying a gun might not have been the cop. Very disturbing.

That's right. Small town force with small town training budget and no idea how best to safely effect a traffic stop. Perhaps that "duty to inform" isn't such a good idea.

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Thought that SAME EXACT THING! "duty to inform"

[mamabearCali]

That was my thought too.

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[wittmeba]

Seems like there is some training needed in the police force. Not pointing fingers or blame but when they ask someone for "license and registration" since most of us carry our license in our wallet and the wallet in pants pockets LE needs to find a way to watch the driver(s) retrieve their wallet. Stay alert but finger off the trigger.

[Ironbear]

That's right. Small town force with small town training budget and no idea how best to safely effect a traffic stop. Perhaps that "duty to inform" isn't such a good idea

I used to live right next to Falcon Heights... no sleepy small town out in the boonies. A small municipality, containing almost exclusively the MN State Fairgrounds and part of the U of MN campus. It is completely surrounded by more urban area, and shares a border with St. Paul. Hardly backwater, and during the State Fair, probably one of the busiest places in the metro area.

FYI: MN has no "Duty to Inform".

[WRW]

That's right. Small town force with small town training budget and no idea how best to safely effect a traffic stop. Perhaps that "duty to inform" isn't such a good idea

I used to live right next to Falcon Heights... no sleepy small town out in the boonies. A small municipality, containing almost exclusively the MN State Fairgrounds and part of the U of MN campus. It is completely surrounded by more urban area, and shares a border with St. Paul. Hardly backwater, and during the State Fair, probably one of the busiest places in the metro area.

FYI: MN has no "Duty to Inform".

The deceased did inform, according to reports, and it may have been a precipitating factor. That was the extent of reasoning for that comment.

I read that the force was 23. Divided by shifts and days off, that would not make for a very large force. If I am wrong on that assessment or those numbers, I apologize. As it stands currently, it would seem that there was some lack on the department's, or the individual officer's part.

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[kelu]

I said it and I will said it again, you like it or not.
Too many cops these days are attracted to the job by the action and shooting. They see it as a continuation for the video games in the youth. Too many take steroids. Too many are not psychically fit for the job.
Also, the law is wrong, protecting the cop in first place. Change the law, make the cop easier liable and the macho mentality will change after couple high publicized cases.

[SHMIV]

I have noticed that attacking an officer is placed higher than attacking an average citizen. I do have a problem with that. Simply deciding to be a public servant shouldn't put a higher value on your life than choosing to be a plumber, or a financial consultant. We are supposed to be all equal under the law, from the highest office of the land, to the hobo sleeping under the overpass.

I agree that the "Duty to Inform" probably contributed to the escalation of the incident. In today's world, I can understand why hearing "gun" might make a cop jumpy.

Also, in our modern world, we've dropped our standards on everything, in order to make everyone feel good about themselves. This was probably a contributing factor, as well.

When we allow a man to hold a position that he probably isn't fit to hold, is that man to blame, fully, when he causes injury or death to another, while attempting to carry out his duties?

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[WRW]

Policepersons being agents of the State, offenses against policepersons are, then, offenses against the State and the State takes offense at such offenses. Yeah, like it or not. Fabric of society and all that.

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[M1A4ME]

No idea if the info in this story is true or not. If so, would throw a whole different light on the incident.

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/20 ... -shooting/

[mamabearCali]

It would explain why the cop was so jumpy. Now it doesn't mean that it was a good shoot. I also read this AM that he wasn't a CHL holder.

Now I have not got that from a solid source, but if he wasn't then that explains why he informed with "I have a gun." Instead of a carefully rehearsed "officer I am concealed carry permit holder and I am carrying concealed today." If he wasn't a CHL then he didn't have he very basic training on what to say.


Now none of this changes shoot/ no shoot but it does add context.

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[Viper21]

No idea if the info in this story is true or not. If so, would throw a whole different light on the incident.

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/20 ... -shooting/

Wow...!!! I'd say that changes the narrative significantly. Watching the posted video, it was easy to lean to the deceased person's side of the story as presented by the woman. However, I remember thinking...... it's unfortunate that the video doesn't start until after the shooting because, her story might be BS.

This version of events certainly seems plausible & appears very damning for the deceased. Especially the still shot photo that shows what looks like a handgun in dead man's lap.

[wittmeba]

Dude in Minnesota told the Cop "I have a CHP", the cop said "Get your license", then shot him 4 times...

and it's on video...

...and the Chief said "I am appalled at this behavior, and have questions as well. In that stead, I am asking the U.S. Attorney General's office to investigate to mitigate any accusations of covering things up, and will stand by their findings."

At least the Chief of Police realizes "You effed up something fierce."

I agree with this. These LE's must realize that ANY stopping of drivers -- they will be required to reach for their pockets, glove box, console where ever they store their license, registration and proof of insurance. The LE's need to be extra alert if they feel they may be threatened but not shoot first then see if his statement is true.

This particular LE (from the TV news video) did not sound like he was 100% mentally there. He just sounded off and perhaps should not have been on duty that particular day or maybe any other day.

Edit: I did not read where anyone confirmed if he did or did not have a CWP. With his rap sheet (not known before the pulling over) I doubt he held a license to carry.