No Rifles Larger Than .22 Explanation

[Leanback]

Hi everyone,

Looking into predator hunting on the 2 WMA's in Caroline county (Pettigrew and Mattiponi) since both are within 20 minutes of the house. I was looking into the local firearm ordinances for Caroline county and seen the rule: no rifles larger than .22 for hunting except for groundhogs outside of the regular hunting season.

To me this means i can use any .22 caliber rifle rimfire or centerfire, for ex. 22-250,223,22wmr and 22lr is this correct or just wishful thinking on my part?

I just want to make sure i understand the laws completely before i head out to hunt.

[OakRidgeStars]

I'd call that wishful thinking. I have serious doubts that the possum cop will let you use centerfire ammunition in those calibers.

I'd say it's intention is for rimfire only.

[Leanback]

I'd call that wishful thinking. I have serious doubts that the possum cop will let you use centerfire ammunition in those calibers.

I'd say it's intention is for rimfire only.

Read more: http://vagunforum.net/posting.php?mode= ... z2krSO8cVS



Thanks Oak, I have the same suspicion, although they did not specify that specifically in the book. there are other limitations for other counties and they specify .22 rimfire only. This is where my confusion lies.

[OakRidgeStars]

The best answer is going to come from the folks that enforce hunting regulations.

http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/contact/

[TScottW99]

I have no restrictions up my way yet we use 12ga #4 buck a good bit. I patterned my Stoger 2000 with a pretty tight choke & it does great.

[Leanback]

I have no restrictions up my way yet we use 12ga #4 buck a good bit. I patterned my Stoger 2000 with a pretty tight choke & it does great.

This will be my next option if i won't be able to use a .22magnum. I was really wanting to use a rifle/shotgun combo so that i have the best of both worlds.

Whats your max yardage you get with the #4 buckshot?

[M1A4ME]

Remember, the laws are set up/passed by folks who are not only NOT experts, but usually don't have much experience either.

Down here its different county to county. Some places you can hunt with a muzzle loader if you're up in a tree stand, but you can't hunt with slugs in your shotgun from the same tree stand???? No kidding. As if a big ol' muzzle loader bullet/ball won't go as far or do as much damage as a slug.

Then again, you have the individual differences in understanding/enforcement among the game wardens. I know my dad, when he had questions, would call the local game warden to question him about it. He's the guy you're going to run into in the woods/fields, not the guys who made the law.

[TScottW99]

With regular lead buck you can shoot 30-40 yards if patterned. You can up that range with Hevi-Shot predator or T shot loads.

[Leanback]

Then again, you have the individual differences in understanding/enforcement among the game wardens.

Yea, i was hoping some folks have already had these types of questions answered by some game wardens that could explain it to me a little better. I will be making some phone calls tomorrow to try and get a better understanding.

With regular lead buck you can shoot 30-40 yards if patterned. You can up that range with Hevi-Shot predator or T shot loads.

Thanks Tscott, I am going to start looking into the predator loads and some of the high performance 410 and 20ga slugs. I have heard you can get some really nice rifled slug barrels these days turning 410s and 20ga's into pretty accurate and fast slug guns.

[Leanback]

I spoke with the DGIF this morning, they said i would have to talk directly to the Caroline county sheriffs dept. due to the fact that it was a county ordinance. So i called them up, dispatch transferred me over to a deputy, I asked about the specifics of the ordinance, she specifically said that the ordinance does not state whether it is rimfire or centerfire so as long as the caliber is .22 or smaller then it is a legal cartridge.

So i am left with the assumption that any bullet diameter .224 or smaller is a legal cartridge due to the fact that a 22lr bullet diameter is .223 which is larger than .220. They have to be rounding the numbers, if not a 22lr would be illegal.

Does this sound logical or am i just digging to deep to come up with a reason to hunt with something other than a rimfire cartridge or a shotgun?

[Machias]

One thing I would do is get an e-mail and e-mail this question to the Sheriff's Dept so that you have it in writing. Then you can have a copy to carry with you in case you run into a Deputy that has a different interpretation. I've had to do that a couple of times out west with vague laws.

On a side note this just makes me want to move out of this wacky state even faster. Your telling me that each county can make up their own rules for hunting? Unfrickenbelievable.

I have killed several yotes out to 60 yards with 00 Buck. I always carry both the shotgun and the .223 rifle when predator hunting, day or night.

[Machias]

P.S. Leanback if you even want to hook up for a night hunt, let me know, I'm not too far from you.

[TacticalTedcom]

I was an LEO and one must go by what the law specifically says. No matter what the intention, it's the specific wording that matters in court. I would not charge you for using a 22 centerfire as the law does not specify 22 rimfire.

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[TacticalTedcom]

I was an LEO and one must go by what the law specifically says. No matter what the intention, it's the specific wording that matters in court. I would not charge you for using a 22 centerfire as the law does not specify 22 rimfire.

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[Machias]

I'm a 20 year retired cop. I've had three instances in just the past two years where Law Enforcement was not only wrong, but in one instance they were even teaching all their new recruits the wrong thing. It's actually been pretty shocking to me how many times they are completely wrong. In the state of WA they have an awesome law for folks, Anyone engaged in a Lawful outdoor activity can carry concealed without a CPL. However you ask 85% of Law Enforcement in the state and they will tell you, you can't, because the instructors at the academy have been teaching the wrong thing. Even had to help get the law changed for bow hunters and muzzle loaders, when the WA Fish and Game allowed those user groups to open carry only as long as they had a CPL. Which was opposite of the state law. When it was pointed out the Enforcement Chief for the State Fish and Wildlife was unaware of the law.

In Idaho you can use beaver as bear bait, as long as it is skinned, but up until spring of 2012 if you called the ID Fish and Game they would tell you it's illegal because someone there was wrongly classifying beaver as a game animal. I still have that e-mail correction saved for future encounters. I would get it in an e-mail, save you a lot of grief later on.

[Leanback]

I finally got to speak to a conservation officer (The guy at the office told me not call them game wardens) over the phone out of the Richmond office. Once he got his head out of his ass and stopped ranting about how you are not allowed to deer hunt with a 22 rifle. I was finally able to get him to actually listen to my question. He finally realized i was talking about predator hunting which i had specifically mentioned in the beginning of our conservation.

He asked me what specific round i was wanting to use, i replied .223, he then began to explain to me that that was too high powered and that they don't want anyone running around the woods with an assault round it's too dangerous. I said ok thanks for your time officer, hung up and am still scratching my head.

One thing I would do is get an e-mail and e-mail this question to the Sheriff's Dept so that you have it in writing. Then you can have a copy to carry with you in case you run into a Deputy that has a different interpretation. I've had to do that a couple of times out west with vague laws.

I agree Machias, I need to get in touch with someone there that is willing to help me out with a letter stating the fact that both rimfire and centerfire ammunition can be used. This would keep me from getting cited by an officer that interprets the law differently than intended.

I was an LEO and one must go by what the law specifically says. No matter what the intention, it's the specific wording that matters in court. I would not charge you for using a 22 centerfire as the law does not specify 22 rimfire.

Taticaltedcom, this would be awesome if it actually worked that way. if the officer that i mentioned above was to approach me in the field he would have cited me with a violation. This is what i am trying to avoid, I want to know and understand all the laws before i go out in the field.

[WRW]

C. In the counties west of the Blue Ridge Mountains, and counties east of the Blue Ridge where rifles of a caliber larger than .22 caliber may be used for hunting wild birds and animals, game birds and animals may be hunted with pistols or revolvers firing cartridges rated in manufacturers' tables at 350 foot pounds of energy or greater and under the same restrictions and conditions as apply to rifles, provided that no cartridge shall be used with a bullet of less than .23 caliber. In no event shall pistols or revolvers firing cartridges rated in manufacturers' tables at 350 foot pounds of energy or greater be used if rifles of a caliber larger than .22 caliber are not authorized for hunting purposes.

From: http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504 ... d+29.1-519

For .223, I don't see less than 1,000 ft. Lbs. I'd say the game warden has it right.

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[Leanback]

Thanks WRW, after reading it about 20 times i believe i have came to the same conclusion as you did. in or around the 12th or 13th time i read the paragraph i thought it was just regarding pistol law had to match rifle law regarding caliber. I kept reading and finally got it, i think my wife is still confused lol.

[WRW]

Thanks for bringing me back to this. The wording is, pretty much, as you describe and I have to wonder about the intent. Interesting enough, I found, ""Game warden" means supervising wardens, and regular and special game warden."" in another section.

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