Virginia Gun Owners Forum - VGOF

I've never personally owned a Knights, but I've generally heard good things about their products. The only real complaint I've heard of is the cost, which is common for high-end manufacturers like Knights. You're probably going to have a hard time finding someone with first hand knowledge as they don't sell a lot (relatively).

The ambi control is nice, but you can easily add that to any AR. Same with the two stage trigger. I've had both two stage triggers and single stage for my ARs. At the moment my preference is for single stage (Wilson's TTU) on a CQB AR. YMMV and I've never used Knights two stage trigger. An interesting feature, but one I don't know anything about, is the improved bolt. There are a few "built-in" features or tweaks are kind of neat too.

It looks like a nice rig, Knights is suppose to be well built, and if it has the accessories you desire I'm sure you'll be happy with it. It would definitely give you a different rig and probably attract some attention at the range.

If you want a mil-spec AR with a few modular features Daniel Defense is the way to go IMHO. I really like a midlength (16" barrel and slightly longer gas system...tuned for 16" rather than 14.5"). It doesn't come with a nice trigger, etc. but you can easily add them. I prefer that because I like a lighter weight AR for CQB. If I were going to build a precision AR, I'd probably go Larue. What Knights brings to the table is some unique integrated features that you simply can't get anywhere else. Their not add-ons, their built into the firearm. I'd consider Knights to be on par with DD/Larue in quality. Knights has a few special features, but the Omega rail on DD's is the best out there IMHO. I like how it's oval shaped so once you add rail covers it doesn't feel like you're holding a 5" pipe...much slimmer. I choose DD because it was the best high-quality AR which I could tweak with my preferences without throwing out nice parts.

For irons I had a fixed 'F' front post sight and DD's rear fixed sight. The rear is decent, but I'm thinking of swapping it out for Magpuls flip up. My preference is for a fixed front post, YMMV. The red dot was an Aimpoint T1. If you want really lightweight get the DD T1 mount, but it's not QD. Otherwise for a few ozs more you can get the QD Larue is the best QD IMHO. If you're looking for a CQB (i.e. mostly <100 yards and max of ~200 yards), the T1 is the sight to have. If you want to reach out with more accuracy an ACOG is the way to go IMHO (must have BAC to make it worth it) IMHO.

Those are my preferences, but it really depends on what you want to build. I consider the AR to be a great CQB platform as long as it's kept reasonably light. That is why I prefer the setups I do, I'm optimizing for CQB (e.g. home defense). If you're thinking SHTF, consider that at longer ranges is probably best to disengage and of course augment your AR with combined arms (e.g. someone with a M1A/AR10/bolt).

What is the purpose of the rifle?

The Knights is a great rifle. I know a few people that own them, and they all love them. We are a dealer for KAC so I've gotten the chance to handle a few and I am always very impressed with them.

The thing I like about the Knight's rifles is that there is very little to upgrade on them. They've got the freefloated railed handguard installed, come with very nice flip up iron sights, the controls are already ambidextrous, the trigger is very nice, and it's got the very comfortable SOPMOD stock. The E3 bolt has a beefier extractor that has two (instead of the milspec one) extractor springs, as well as several improvements to the bolt face, locking lugs, and cam pin hole to increase overall quality and reliability of the bolt. All it really needs is an optic and it's good to go.

RocKor wrote:The E3 bolt has a beefier extractor that has two (instead of the milspec one) extractor springs, as well as several improvements to the bolt face, locking lugs, and cam pin hole to increase overall quality and reliability of the bolt. All it really needs is an optic and it's good to go.

There's only so much you can change and remain compatible. Does the E3 bolt require a different or special barrel extension or anything besides the obvious bolt/extractor changes?

As long as we are talking about possibly proprietary ARs, Barrett makes a nice one. One of these days I want to pick up a Lewis Machine and Tool AR. Not sure what caliber, but larger than 5.56mm as I already have those. http://www.lewismachine.net/

Yes, a .308 LMT with AAC suppressor (perhaps the .300WM Ti one for weight savings, but then you'd have to monitor your rate of fire) and a S&B 1-8x CQB scope on Larue QD rings, gotta get NV too...hmm, rifle or car...

gunderwood wrote:

RocKor wrote:The E3 bolt has a beefier extractor that has two (instead of the milspec one) extractor springs, as well as several improvements to the bolt face, locking lugs, and cam pin hole to increase overall quality and reliability of the bolt. All it really needs is an optic and it's good to go.

There's only so much you can change and remain compatible. Does the E3 bolt require a different or special barrel extension or anything besides the obvious bolt/extractor changes?

From what I understand, there are/were two versions of the E3 bolt. One version is/was sold as a stand alone and has regular locking lugs for regular AR-style barrel extensions. The one that ships within the SR-15 rifle has the enhanced locking lugs and is proprietary and only fits the barrel extension present on the Knight's rifles, again from what i understand.

Yes there is a proprietary extension.

Regarding the E3, the big difference (besides dual extractor springs) is that the lugs are rounded, the extractor hook is beefier, and the cam pin is narrowed for strength. it's something new, whether it's an improvement who knows, its a nice design for what it is.



I like my IWS and it always gets attention where ever we go, but I have AR's I built from a variety of high-end manufactures parts that cost much less and easily out-shoot it any day.

breacher wrote:Yes there is a proprietary extension.

Regarding the E3, the big difference (besides dual extractor springs) is that the lugs are rounded, the extractor hook is beefier, and the cam pin is narrowed for strength. it's something new, whether it's an improvement who knows, its a nice design for what it is.



I like my IWS and it always gets attention where ever we go, but I have AR's I built from a variety of high-end manufactures parts that cost much less and easily out-shoot it any day.

Admittedly, I haven't kept up on Knights development, but I'd guess isn't an attempt to fix the carbine broken lug issue. Adding ~1.5" of barrel to a gas system really designed for a 14.5" barrel was causing some problems...especially if you suppress it. Also, going below 12" was an issue too.

Edit: That's why I prefer a mid-length gas system and a 16" barrel, it's the correct gas system for the barrel length. However, unless you're shooting a lot of rounds you'd probably never break a lug.

Agreed.

Under extreme full-auto, which would be most likely when that could happen, KAC claims their 'rounded' lugs will outlast the traditional design. I have no way to test this claim, I do own a select fire lower but I don't make enough money to cover ammo cost.

Being the owner of several KAC guns and parts...If I had to choose a KAC E3 bolt or a Young's National Match, I'd go Young's any day. Young Mfg carriers alone are a work of CNC precision art... and KAC carriers are still cast (nothing special) vs Young's are machined. A complete Young BCG cost less then an E3 bolt alone. Even a Colt BCG is less and they're battlefield proven.

To get back on topic, another reason to buy an IWS is that KAC anything holds its value better then any other brand. Back on 2006 when KAC was not selling to the public, I sold my slightly used M4 RAS forend I bought for $350.00 new and it was bid up to $640.00 which is nuts. People go crazy for KAC.

breacher wrote:Agreed.

Under extreme full-auto, which would be most likely when that could happen, KAC claims their 'rounded' lugs will outlast the traditional design. I have no way to test this claim, I do own a select fire lower but I don't make enough money to cover ammo cost.

Makes sense, basic engineering saws that rounded corners are more durable and unlikely to break. The question how often do regular lugs break off? Anyone every had one break?

breacher wrote:To get back on topic, another reason to buy an IWS is that KAC anything holds its value better then any other brand. Back on 2006 when KAC was not selling to the public, I sold my slightly used M4 RAS forend I bought for $350.00 new and it was bid up to $640.00 which is nuts. People go crazy for KAC.

That's a good argument for a KAC toy. As long as you treat it like a range queen (let's be honest, most are), it's probably a good investment.