Kershaw Slicing - 9?Slicing - 9?
Kershaw
    Kershaw Bread Blade - 6"Bread Blade - 6"
Kershaw
    Klymit Inertia X-Lite Or/GrayInertia X-Lite Or/Gray
Klymit

Proposed new ML hunting regulation

If you're into blowing smoke, this is the forum for you!

Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby guitarpicva » Mon, 08 Nov 2010 10:29:33

I have recently approached my district DGIF board member to inquire about creating a common-sense regulation allowing muzzle-loading pistols for big game. Many states already allow this with restrictions on caliber (> .45), barrel length (>10 inches), and energy (>500 ft. lbs. at 100 yds.). (my source for these numbers is Wyoming Chapter 2, Section 2(s)).

http://gf.state.wy.us/admin/regulations ... 262010.pdf

"Why?" you might ask. Well, considering that under current commonwealth regulations, in counties that allow rifles and handguns to be used for big game, I can legally use my 9mm with 2.5" barrel to take game (with the right ammo), it certainly seems logical to be able use a ML pistol with an appropriate load.
Pistols and revolvers are lawful for deer and bear hunting only in those counties where hunting deer and bear with rifles is lawful. Cartridges used must be .23 caliber or larger and have a manufacturer's rating of 350 foot-pounds muzzle energy or more.


I would propose that this be allowed anywhere muzzle-loading firearms are allowed today, and not limit this to counties allowing rifle hunting.

If you agree that this is a worthwhile rule change, why not email or call your DGIF board member and suggest such a rule change also?

You can find your board member, by congressional district, here:

http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/about/board/
guitarpicva
|||||| [o] VA


User avatar
guitarpicva
Marksman
Marksman
 
Posts: 94
Joined: Tue, 08 Dec 2009 10:56:22
First Name: Mitch

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby gunderwood » Mon, 08 Nov 2010 19:15:02

I propose the government stay out of my business...
sudo modprobe commonsense
FATAL: Module commonsense not found.


User avatar
gunderwood
VGOF Platinum Supporter
VGOF Platinum Supporter
 
Posts: 7184
Joined: Sat, 19 Dec 2009 00:28:34

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby Diomed » Tue, 09 Nov 2010 02:58:06

gunderwood wrote:I propose the government stay out of my business...

Not when you're hunting the king's animals, peasant!


User avatar
Diomed
Sharp Shooter
Sharp Shooter
 
Posts: 1891
Joined: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 02:28:14
Location: Central VA
First Name: Nah

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby SgtBill » Tue, 09 Nov 2010 09:59:25

Sorry, but I don't feel that most people are competent with a handgun to hunt with them in black powder where they will only be limited to one shot that just might be a wounding shot. It is bad enough that some or most people that I know don't practice with the Black Powder weapons that they have untill the day prior to Hunting Season.
Bill


Active, Reserve or Veteran of the United States Marine Corps   Active, Reserve or Veteran of the United States Air Force  
SgtBill
VGOF Silver Supporter
VGOF Silver Supporter
 
Posts: 1624
Joined: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 09:31:47
Location: Charlotte County Va.
First Name: Bill

My Arsenal:
Too many to list.

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby guitarpicva » Tue, 09 Nov 2010 14:15:41

SgtBill wrote:Sorry, but I don't feel that most people are competent with a handgun to hunt with them in black powder where they will only be limited to one shot that just might be a wounding shot. It is bad enough that some or most people that I know don't practice with the Black Powder weapons that they have untill the day prior to Hunting Season.
Bill


That mentality could be attached to any firearm or archery tackle. We shouldn't regulate in an attempt to abate stupidity.

A bow is a one shot deal. A crossbow is a one shot deal. A ML rifle is a one shot deal. How does the length of the barrel make it any different than a ML rifle? It's just as accurate. I don't think your argument is a valid one. If it were, so many other states would not allow it already.
guitarpicva
|||||| [o] VA


User avatar
guitarpicva
Marksman
Marksman
 
Posts: 94
Joined: Tue, 08 Dec 2009 10:56:22
First Name: Mitch

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby gunderwood » Tue, 09 Nov 2010 16:59:03

Diomed wrote:
gunderwood wrote:I propose the government stay out of my business...

Not when you're hunting the king's animals, peasant!

England had very restrictive hunting laws and we inherited some of them. Granted, most of the hunting laws were historically ignored.
sudo modprobe commonsense
FATAL: Module commonsense not found.


User avatar
gunderwood
VGOF Platinum Supporter
VGOF Platinum Supporter
 
Posts: 7184
Joined: Sat, 19 Dec 2009 00:28:34

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby zephyp » Tue, 09 Nov 2010 20:42:03

gunderwood wrote:I propose the government stay out of my business...


There isnt a big enough thumbs up graphic to do this statement justice...
No more catchy slogans for me...I am simply fed up...4...four...4...2+2...

Image


User avatar
zephyp
VGOF Platinum Supporter
VGOF Platinum Supporter
 
Posts: 10207
Joined: Tue, 05 May 2009 08:40:55
Location: Springfield, VA
First Name: DK

My Arsenal:
My Favs:
Whatever gets the job done.

Next Firearm:
M-1 Garand

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby Diomed » Wed, 10 Nov 2010 03:32:56

gunderwood wrote:England had very restrictive hunting laws and we inherited some of them. Granted, most of the hunting laws were historically ignored.

And those laws made some sense, from a tragedy of the commons perspective. Not so much an issue anymore, both from overpopulation of game animals and the fact that most land is privately owned, and in theory anyway, doesn't belong to the king.


User avatar
Diomed
Sharp Shooter
Sharp Shooter
 
Posts: 1891
Joined: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 02:28:14
Location: Central VA
First Name: Nah

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby SgtBill » Wed, 10 Nov 2010 10:05:48

guitarpicva wrote:
SgtBill wrote:Sorry, but I don't feel that most people are competent with a handgun to hunt with them in black powder where they will only be limited to one shot that just might be a wounding shot. It is bad enough that some or most people that I know don't practice with the Black Powder weapons that they have untill the day prior to Hunting Season.
Bill


That mentality could be attached to any firearm or archery tackle. We shouldn't regulate in an attempt to abate stupidity.

A bow is a one shot deal. A crossbow is a one shot deal. A ML rifle is a one shot deal. How does the length of the barrel make it any different than a ML rifle? It's just as accurate. I don't think your argument is a valid one. If it were, so many other states would not allow it already.


As I said (most people can not handle a handgun good enough) A handgun with enough power to cleanly harvest a deer will most likely have too much recoil and muzzle flip for a follow up shot.
Bill


Active, Reserve or Veteran of the United States Marine Corps   Active, Reserve or Veteran of the United States Air Force  
SgtBill
VGOF Silver Supporter
VGOF Silver Supporter
 
Posts: 1624
Joined: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 09:31:47
Location: Charlotte County Va.
First Name: Bill

My Arsenal:
Too many to list.

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby guitarpicva » Wed, 10 Nov 2010 10:15:15

SgtBill wrote:
guitarpicva wrote:
SgtBill wrote:Sorry, but I don't feel that most people are competent with a handgun to hunt with them in black powder where they will only be limited to one shot that just might be a wounding shot. It is bad enough that some or most people that I know don't practice with the Black Powder weapons that they have untill the day prior to Hunting Season.
Bill


That mentality could be attached to any firearm or archery tackle. We shouldn't regulate in an attempt to abate stupidity.

A bow is a one shot deal. A crossbow is a one shot deal. A ML rifle is a one shot deal. How does the length of the barrel make it any different than a ML rifle? It's just as accurate. I don't think your argument is a valid one. If it were, so many other states would not allow it already.


As I said (most people can not handle a handgun good enough) A handgun with enough power to cleanly harvest a deer will most likely have too much recoil and muzzle flip for a follow up shot.
Bill


A 900 fps .44 spl or mag or a properly loaded .45 colt is more than sufficient (with an appropriate bullet). They are not brutal to shoot. There are rarely follow-up shots on whitetails anyway. I drilled one through the heart a couple of weekends ago and it was gone in a flash (for about 30 yds.).

If you don't think a handgun can properly kill a deer, check out some of the pictures in the forums at :

http://www.handgunhunt.com

Most people couldn't handle a bow or crossbow well enough either, yet no-one seems to have any issues with those weapons. Let's be truthful and say out loud that we regulate these things based on who whines the loudest at the board meeting, be it DGIF or county boards of supervisors. It has little to do with the appropriateness of the weapon for killing game.
guitarpicva
|||||| [o] VA


User avatar
guitarpicva
Marksman
Marksman
 
Posts: 94
Joined: Tue, 08 Dec 2009 10:56:22
First Name: Mitch

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby SgtBill » Wed, 10 Nov 2010 10:20:04

You miss my point by a mile. I am not saying that a handgun can't kill a deer in fact I have killed many with handguns over the past 50 year's. I am saying that the majority of people can't handle a handgun well enough to harvest a deer cleanly.
Bill


Active, Reserve or Veteran of the United States Marine Corps   Active, Reserve or Veteran of the United States Air Force  
SgtBill
VGOF Silver Supporter
VGOF Silver Supporter
 
Posts: 1624
Joined: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 09:31:47
Location: Charlotte County Va.
First Name: Bill

My Arsenal:
Too many to list.

Re: Proposed new ML hunting regulation

Postby guitarpicva » Wed, 10 Nov 2010 10:22:30

SgtBill wrote:...
As I said (most people can not handle a handgun good enough) ...


And what does this have to do with the appropriateness or effectiveness of any given weapon? I can't shoot a bow, so I don't. Doesn't mean I can't shoot a ML handgun, nor should I be prohibited from doing so as long as the game animal is honored with a clean kill.
guitarpicva
|||||| [o] VA


User avatar
guitarpicva
Marksman
Marksman
 
Posts: 94
Joined: Tue, 08 Dec 2009 10:56:22
First Name: Mitch



Return to Muzzleloaders and Black Powder

Who is online

Registered users: Google [Bot], kelu, Kreutz, Majestic-12 [Bot], MarcSpaz, MSNbot Media, rlbellco72, RO73, Winever, Yahoo [Bot]

cron
Shop Here!
Help support VGOF!


AIG Tactical - Do it now!
Red Stitch Tactical